Verizon refuses to increase internet speed unless I switch to Digital Voice!

[custe7]

I currently have 25/15 internet speed that Verizon is charging an outrageous rate.  I also have traditional phone service and no TV.    I have contacted Verizon several times in an effort to get a price to increase my internet speed to 200/200.   Multiple Verizon Representatives , both by phone and chat,  have refused to provide me with a simple quote for me to increase my internet speed.  They instead provide me with a quote to both increase my internet speed and to change my landline service to digital voice.   This is even after I specifically stated that I do not want Digital voice.   They also give me the tired old runaround about how Verizon wants customers to transfer out of copper service  into Digital Voice (unregulated).  This is even after I tell them that I have already changed from copper service as was required in my area a few years ago.

What is so surprising is that Verizon would rather I have no phone service at all and only internet service than to have me pay for a service with increased internet speeds and also my current phone service.    Multiple agents on different occasions told me if I cancelled my current phone service and only had Fios internet they could not only provide me with higher internet speeds but they would give me the rate offered to new customers.   How much sense does this make?

I have also been stunned by the combative, rude, and unprofessional attitudes of the Verizon reps.     Does Verizon actually want me to go to their competitor for my internet service after being a loyal customer for many years??  I am beginning to think they do.

[Cang_Household]

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@custe7 wrote:

This is even after I tell them that I have already changed from copper service as was required in my area a few years ago.

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If you changed from copper service, what have you changed to? There are only copper voice and digital voice. Digital voice does not mean VoIP, it is still POT on your premise, not withstanding it is VoIP on VZ layer 3 network.

I think you are already on digital voice. If that's the case, please post the model number of your ONT to see if you need an ONT upgrade to get higher speeds. Your new monthly estimate for 300/300 and digital voice 1 line should be $40 + $25 = $65 + tax w/ auto pay.

[custe7]

I do not have Digital Voice. Verizon came out and disconnected the copper and upgraded the ONT with battery backup but I still have Freedom Essentials as I told them at that time I did not want Digital Voice. And yes I still have to dial "1" before the area code.    There is no technical reason they can not increase my speed as I have an upgraded ONT.  I just don't them changing my phone service to Verizon's for of VOIP (unregulated)  with the web based apps, virtual #'s etc.  They refuse to do this. 

[dexman]

Can a picture of the ONT be posted? It doesn't seem like that it has been upgraded.

The Alcatel-Lucent 211 is black in color and roughly the size of a large paperback book. Older ONTs are made by Tellabs, AFC or Motorola.

Note that posted pictures are queued for a moderator to review before they appear.

Verizon, as noted, is going to eventually decommission all of it's legacy switches. Even users with copper drops into their house or apartment will be moved.

I had Verizon Freedom Essentials up until May 2021 when I upgraded my Internet service from 75/75 to 400/400 to now 940/940. Verizon replaced the old Tellabs 611 with an Alcatel-Lucent 211 and moved me off of their legacy 5E over to their regional packet switch. There haven't been any service issues to date.

I just checked with a friend of mine who is a Comcast user. When he calls his family out of state, he dials 10 digits. I don't know anyone who subscribes to the other cable service provider (RCN) but my suspicions are they too are being serviced by packet switches.

[custe7]

Dexman Wrote:

(193 Views)

Can a picture of the ONT be posted? It doesn't seem like that it has been upgraded.

My ONT is the 1-21M-L model.  My understanding is that this model is very capable of even Gigibit service.   There is no reason that Verizon can not just "flip a switch" on their end to increase my internet speed and charge me accordingly.  They should not need to change my current Freedom Essentials.  Again, they already got what they wanted regarding disconnecting my copper on my end.

[gs0b]

The technical issue is the de-commissioning of the circuit switched network behind the ONT.  The ONT will eventually have nothing to connect to for circuit switched phone service.  That's why they are telling you to switch to FDV.

FDV is cheaper, more reliable and offers more features than Freedom Essentials.  You don't have to use the additional features.  The question really is, why aren't you switching?

[custe7]

Thank you for your comments.  

To recap:  My current services include POTS ( Plain Old Telephone Service)  over Fiber and FIOS internet.

1) If I cancel my current phone service and keep only Fios internet service, Verizon is happy to increase my  current speed (25/15) to whatever I want.  In fact, they have said that they would give me the new customer rate which is less than half of what I am currently paying.  ((No upgrade to my equipment at my house would be needed.)

2)  If I cancel my Fios internet service , which I would then get through Verizon's cable competitor, and keep my current POTS over fiber telephone service Verizon is OK with that.   (No upgrade to my equipment at my house would be needed.)

3) BUT....  if I request to keep my current  POTS over fiber telephone service and my current  Fios internet but at an increased speed Verizon wants no part of that.   In order to increase my Fios internet speed they require me change my current  POTS over fiber telephone service which is  REGULATED as a public utility,  to their UNREGULATED  digital voice (VOIP) telephone service.    (No upgrade to my equipment at my house would be needed to increase my speed.) 

Under no circumstances does this make sense, regardless of how great you think Digital Voice is.   

It makes one wander why Verizon wants so badly for their customers to change their landline service from the POTS over fiber, which is still regulated as a public utility,  to the unregulated Digital Voice.

Keep in mind that Verizon has consistently committed to both state regulators and the FCC continue to service POTS over fiber telephone service.    In a recent FCC filing Verizon stated that following copper retirement customers "my continue to receive the same traditional POTS service over fiber on the same terms and conditions and at the same or better price as they received over copper". 

State regulators such as the Massachusetts DTC "requires that Verizon make available to all residential customers in Verizon's service territory a regulated landline voice telephone service".

I question Verizon's tactics of steering customers away from regulated to unregulated phone services. 

As a customer all  I want is to stay with my current regulated POTS over fiber service. and ton increase my internet speed.  Not complicated. 

[gs0b]

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@custe7 wrote:

As a customer all  I want is to stay with my current regulated POTS over fiber service. and ton increase my internet speed.  Not complicated. 

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Just to be clear, your speaking to other customers here.  While we've given you feedback on what may be behind Verizon's reasoning.  None of us have any ability to change what Verizon will or won't do.  You'll have to take that up with them.  What we can do is offer you ways to work with their offerings to get what you want.

I'm curious why you insist on staying with POTS over fiber, when FDV will give you more service for less money.  Can you comment?  Not complicated.

[custe7]

gs0b Wrote:

I'm curious why you insist on staying with POTS over fiber, when FDV will give you more service for less money. Can you comment? Not complicated.

I know who I am speaking to and you are obviously not reading and/ or comprehending my post.  Why I insist on staying with POTS over fiber is irrelevant.

[Cang_Household]

If your rationale is irrelevant to this conversation, we are unable to give you further advice.

You are insisting on asking for a legacy package that VZ does not want to offer. Unfortunately, you cannot get it, and perhaps this is end of the story.

[gs0b]

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@custe7 wrote:

I know who I am speaking to and you  are obviously not reading and/ or comprehending my post.  Why I insist on staying with POTS over fiber in irrelevent.

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Okay... then what do you want to accomplish here?  Nobody on this forum can change Verizon's policies.  We can help you navigate their various offerings, which we've done in great detail.  If you don't like the information we're providing, that doesn't change the fact that nobody here can "flip a switch" as we don't work for Verizon.

If you'd like to explore the differences between regulated POTS and unregulated FDV, I can do that.  But it sounds like you've made up your mind.

As I see it, your choices are:

• Switch to FDV, save money, get more.
• Stay on POTs over fiber, switch to another ISP
• Switch to another phone provider, stay on fios for ISP
• Escalate to Verizon, but I think you've done that.

Your choice.

[Cang_Household]

I agree with gs0b, why don't you switch to digital voice?

It is not that simple to "flip a switch."

[Cang_Household]

I don’t see major differences between Freedom Essentials and Digital Voice. Any reason to stay on Freedom Essentials? FDV may be cheap anyway.

The current account system does not allow modifications to grandfathered plans I believe.

[gs0b]

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@custe7 wrote:

I do not have Digital Voice. Verizon came out and disconnected the copper and upgraded the ONT with battery backup but I still have Freedom Essentials as I told them at that time I did not want Digital Voice. And yes I still have to dial "1" before the area code.    There is no technical reason they can not increase my speed as I have an upgraded ONT.  I just don't them changing my phone service to Verizon's for of VOIP (unregulated)  with the web based apps, virtual #'s etc.  They refuse to do this. 

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It's been a long time since Verizon provisioned regulated phone service on fios accounts.  It works by establishing a circuit of the ATM protocol used on BPON.  It's probably a CBR (constant bit rate) circuit fixed at 64KB with another circuit for supervision.  Classic telephone networking, as it an extension of the circuit switched telephone network.  It's been a long time since I've worked on ATM or circuit switched networks, so my memory is a bit foggy and I might not have all the details 100% correct.

Back in the day, you could order any available regulated phone service over fiber, whether it be a full package like "Freedom Essentials" or something else.  But not any more.

As the years have gone by, Verizon no longer sells regulated service over fiber to new accounts.  They want to move everyone to VoIP services so they can de-commission the switched telephone network equipment.  That's why you're getting this push back from them.

It may also be complicated by GPON not being ATM based, as that may make it harder to provision a traditional telephone line over it.  I'm not entirely sure about this, because it's been years since I looked at the details of the GPON spec.

All that said, FDV is a solid product.  It is run on hardware and networks Verizon has dedicated for voice services.  They manage and maintain the VoIP servers and infrastructure and have dedicated bandwidth within their network for voice communications.  You do not need to use apps or websites to use FDV.  Everything you can do with a regulated service from a telephone set can be done from a telephone set on  FDV.  Sure, features like simultaneous ring and voice mail by e-mail require web-site login to manage.  But you don't have to use them if you don't want to.

I'm not sure what you mean by a "virtual number."  FDV numbers work just like any other phone service.  Plug in a landline phone to the ONT's phone jack, then make and receive calls using the number associated with the jack.  If you get a second line with a second phone number, plug in a phone to the line two jack on the ONT.

On top of all that, FDV is cheaper than regulated service.  It usually runs about $30/month, while Freedom Essentials is more like $50 or $60.  I've had FDV for over a decade and it's been much better than the copper line it replaced.  I never had any problems with FDV.  Pricing for voice has been consistent, although pricing for TV service and internet has been an issue over the years.

In short, you will likely save money while getting more features by switching to FDV.

[dexman]

It may vary from state to state, but I pay $20/month for my Digital Voice service. Taxes goose the total up somewhat. That amount is still less than what I was paying for Freedom Essentials.

[dexman]

Verizon is in the lengthy process of decommissioning its legacy Central Office digital voice switches and migrating users over to packet switches.

At some point all Verizon (Ma Bell) users will be moved whether or not they are subscribed to FiOS.

The quickest way to tell if you are already a Digital Voice user is to make a long distance telephone call.

If you are required to add a "1" before the area code you are still being serviced by a legacy voice switch (Nortel DMS-10, Nortel DMS-100 or Western Electric/AT&T/Lucent/Alcatel-Lucent/Nokia 5E)

If you can make the call by pressing only 10 digits you are being serviced by a packet switch and are a Digital Voice user.