Netflix is slow lately on FIOS

[glugglug]

For the past few weeks I am intermittently getting only 1-2 bars on the bandwidth meter for the XBOX Netflix app, which I think means it is ~1-2Mbps.

I have a 35/35Mbps plan with FIOS, so it should be getting HD all the time. (it used to until recently).

Are others having this problem lately?  Is it a FIOS issue or is Netflix downgrading their service for any customers not on OpenConnect ISPs?

[SoNi67]

I did file a complaint. I received an answering machine message stating the name of some guy and a phone number to call (corporate?) if I want, and also he said that somebody from local office will contact me in 48 hours.

It's been over a week now, nothing happend.

[SteveVi]

Well that was quick; I just got a call from "Verizon's Executive Office" to let me know that they had received my BBB complaint and my case was being forwarded to an Escalation Manager.  I expect the EM will pretend they've never heard of the Netlix streaming issue and will try to get me to open a support ticket.  Not gonna happen; at this point all I want is Verizon to release me from my contract.

I'll post again when I have more info.

[SteveVi]

SoNi67,

If you file a complaint directly with Verizon they have zero accountability fi they don;t get back to you.  If you file with the FCC, FTC, BBB, and AG's office, it's a matter of public record and most companies will contact you and make an attempt to resolve the issue is good faith. 

[SteveVi]

I received the following response from Verizon to my Better Business Bureau complaint:

The customer was contacted by Verizon’s Fiber Solutions Center. We are aware of the potential for congestion at certain times of day on certain network connections between Verizon and Cogent. Traffic flows between the two networks are significantly out-of-balance at the moment as a result of increased traffic coming from Cogent's network. Verizon has made proposals to Cogent for ways to address the situation, and will continue to pursue commercial discussions with Cogent regarding appropriate alternative arrangements if Cogent anticipates that it will not be able to satisfy the requirements of our peering arrangement requiring roughly balanced exchange of traffic. Verizon has made proposals to Cogent for ways to address the situation but at the moment there is no time frame for resolution.

I responded as follows:

I’m not really sure how to respond to this.  Simply stating that there’s a problem without offering a solution serves little purpose.  I pay Verizon for 50Mbps internet access.  This service has 8 times the bandwidth required to stream Netflix’s highest resolution SuperHD programming which streams at approximately 6Mbps.  Yet during the hours of approx. 6PM until 1AM I’m lucky if I see stream bitrates of 584Kbps; 1/85th of the speed I pay Verizon for.

Frankly, I don’t care if you’re in talks with Cogent; I pay Verizon for internet access, not Cogent.  Further, it’s a common practice for ISPs to monitor their peering ports and open additional ports as traffic reaches 50% of capacity.  Verizon is allowing its ports to reach 100% of capacity and taking no action to remedy the situation.  Verizon has the resources and equipment in place to prevent this from happening but chooses not to in order to force a financial agreement with Cogent.  

This problem has been going on for months now. Either fix the problem or release me from my contract.

[Namronorman]

Steve,

I love that Verizon continues to point its finger at Cogent when it's much more than Cogent that is being used to deliver content to Verizon Netflix subscribers. I see streams from mostly Level 3 but also from NTT as well. Cogent, Level 3, and NTT are all congested with Verizon. Centurylink/Savvis is used for Amazon. That also goes downhill in the early afternoon/evening.

The above listed transit providers are all Tier 1 - just like Verizon. They all have major congestion issues with Verizon. If I use one of my office's connection - Above.Net/Zayo - I don't have ANY issues with those providers even during peak hours. Verizon is just pretending to be a martyr while pointing its massive red finger at everyone else. This whole thing is a joke and a sham to get other tier 1s to pay Verizon.

At the end of the day, if you pay for Verizon internet, you're actually paying for the privilege to be the product, not the customer. Verizon is using all of its subscribers as leverage against other ISPs - including tier 1s - to extract as much money as possible from both ends. Verizon's peering is terrible. The only difference I see between Verizon and Cogent is that Verizon is significantly more expensive than Cogent.

[SteveVi]

I agree with you--this is all a smoke and mirrors attempt by Verizon to set a precedent that turns the internet into a toll road where anyone moving anything but trivial amounts of traffic has to pay huge sums of money to Verizon.  No good can come of this and it will only perpetuate complex traffic agreements and an environment where providers can extort fees from others by choking their traffic all at the expense of the customer.  Oh, and imagine how much better it’s going to get as content providers begin rolling out 4K ultra high def streams in the future.

I'm not a proponent of government regulation but clearly these clowns can't play nicely and need some serious restrictions on what they can and can’t do.

[optivity]

"The situation with Verizon & Netflix has reached the point of utter absurdity and has gone unanswered and unacknowledged for far too long."

This issue epitomizes what is wrong with the "United Oligarchy of America" these days.

All it takes is a panel of (3) judges appointed to the circuit court & (1) Mega Corporation to decide what information is / is not allowed to traverse the Internet in a useable way.

[bbinnard]

My submission to the BBB:

Filed against : 
Verizon Communications
P.O. Box 9688 
Mission Hills CA 91346

Complaint Description:
Verizon FIOS service provides poor and/or unusable reception/viewing of Netflix content My contract for Verizon FIOS Internet service specifies a data rate which is far more than needed to receive Netflix content at full High Definition quality. However, during prime evening viewing hours Verizon degrades the overall speed of Netflix material to the point that it is unwatchable. This action by Verizon occurs across the USA and is well known and well documented on the Verizon FIOS forum. Verizon customers are looking for some way to get this problem resolved, either by allowing customers to cancel their current contracts at no penalty or by getting Verizon to stop degrading Netflix material.

Your Desired Resolution:
Verizon should either stop degrading Netflix transmissions or allow current customers to cancel their Verizon contract with no penalty.

This case will be reviewed by a complaint specialist at the Better Business Bureau, and then forwarded to the business for their response. It is our policy to allow the business 30 working days to respond to your complaint. You will be notified when the business has responded.

[SteveVi]

I received a call from Verizon a couple of hours ago in response to my BBB claim reply.  The woman I spoke to was pleasant and professional and seemed to know more than she was willing to let on.  As I expected, the conversation started with questions about whether I only have this problem with Netflix of whether I'm seeing the same issues with other streaming sites.  I quickly pointed out that this is not a technical issue, explained that I have done lots of research and that the problem only happens during peak Netflix usage hours and never during off peak hours.  I also pointed out that I have friends and family in close proximity to where I live and the ones who are Verizon customers are having the same issues I am and those who are Comcast customers do not have such issue.

I told her I resented being used as a pawn in Verizon's negotiations with Cogent and Netlix and I she couldn't assure me that the problem was going to be resolved within 30 days, that I wanted to be released from my 24 month contract.  I also told her that I was only one of many, many Verizon customer who felt the same way and that Verizon stood to lose a large number of customers over this issue. 

The final outcome is that Verizon will waive my early termination fees if I cancel my contract.  No apologies, no "we're working on fixing the issue" no "we're sorry to be losing you as a long time customer",just another business as usual transaction.  The updated BBB claim entry is as follows:

Time to start looking into Comcast options. I also have only a couple of months left on my 4 line Verizon Wireless contract, which, with 4 smart phones, data plan, etc., is now close to $250 per month.  That's the next thing to go. 

Congratulations Verizon; you've had me as an internet and wireless customer for close to 15 years and in a matter of less than 2 months have **bleep** me off enough to lose me.

[Namronorman]

Bravo, good sir! I switched from VZW to T-Mobile two days ago and recently got out of my FiOS contract. I'm waiting to see what happens with COMCAST and TWC before I jump ship in regards to wireline. Until then, I am still a FiOS customer. VPNs help a lot with Verizon's terrible peering with half of the Tier 1s in the US.

[geotv]

This is exactly what I am going to do as well.  If the issue isnt fixed by the end of the week, they will be releasing me from my contract for failure to supply what they are charging me for.  Hi Comcast, Im sorry I ever left.  And Comcast is a horrible company!  Whats that say about Verizon?

[tns2]

More hope that this is about to be settled.  Cogent is saying they will pay for peering upgrades.

http://www.multichannel.com/distribution/cogent-ceo-we’ll-pay-peering-upgrades/149015

[SteveVi]

I wouldn't hold my breath.  Cogent is essentially offering to open addtional ports.  The ports aren't needed on the Cogent side--they're needed on the Verizon side.  Verizon's contention is that the Cogent / Verizon peering agreement is lopsided.  Verizon is moving much more data from Cogent than they are sending to Cogent.  Cogent essentially is offering addtional bandwidth to Verizon. 

[db909]

This might go on for awhile.  FIOS wants to be paid by Netflix  like the deal Comcast just signed with Netlfix.

The issue before was that the big ISPs were ganging up on Netflix.  Now that Comcast is delivering good Netflix speeds again, Netflix may decide to not do a similar deal with FIOS.  The risk to FIOS is now there is another option for customes.  Dump FIOS and go to Comcast.

[optivity]

Verizon does not want us to subscribe to Netflix because:

1) They are losing subscribers to their not-so-premium movie channels (e.g. HBO, Starz, etc.)

2) Netflix competes directly with Verizon's PPV & Redbox Instant service

3) Cable TV subscribers are dropping cable TV altogether for just video streaming providers.

Verizon wants to maintain a captive audience and all the talk about Net Neutrality, CDN peering, etc., is just smoke & mirrors to hide the truth.

[Normx]

April 6 2014

Greetings,

i just received my proxyvote for Verizon Com inc.

What a shocker that Verizon has asked the shareholders to vote againts network neutrality, or curbing lobbying activity, or anything that might be benificial for the customer. As soon as Netflix cuts a deal with Verizon, speeds will change. Of couse, Verizon will blame Netflix, Netflix will blame Verizon,  for the cost increase you, the customer,  will have to pay.

What ever you do, don't cut the wire. Just keep paying, and paying, and paying.....

[eric-h]

After being extremely happy when I first moved from Time Warner Cable to FiOS, I never thought I'd say this but I'm actually missing TWC. Their cable box interface was really clunky but I wasn't nickeled and dimed on equipment and fees on my bill. The FiOS TV set top boxes used to have a great interface and now I'm being spammed ads in the guide and it won't turn off the interactive TV feature up-sell promos. The VOD almost always becomes unavailable between midnight and 3am and Verizon hasn't done anything to ensure content can be updated from providers without VOD cutting out.

Then there's the internet. I must live in a great area, but in the year and a half I only had one TWC internet service interruption and that was caused by a drunk driver hitting one of their distribution boxes. FiOS on the other hand regularly goes out for 15 to 45 minutes in the middle of the night about once every week or two. And now the Netflix issues.

I'm paying a ton of money for FiOS services, I'm paying Netflix, and now Verizon wants to also get money from Netflix? In evenings many times I can't connect in the last couple weeks and when I can, the streaming quality is the lower rate SD content instead of HD. Multiple players can barely do 480P SD streams over Verizon. But if I route my connection over a VPN into other family's cable internet connection and back out onto the internet (also over their connection)... perfect Netflix Super HD streaming. I can actually get better and more consistent HD streams using a 4G WiFi hotspot on T-Mobile than I can through my FiOS connection.

Apparently calling tech support will do nothing except the basic troubleshooting, blame Netflix, contact Netflix, them blame Verizon (and rightly so), ad nauseam. And the multiple threads in this forum and reps likely aren't able to assist much. So my recommendation is write a letter to the FCC. Verizon wants to screw their customers over and double-dip trying to get money from both sides then I think some additional regulation might (unfortunately) be the best bet.

fcc.gov/complaints

[optivity]

I just paid my monthly FiOS bill of $212.00 and Verizon will begrudge me the $8.00 per month I'd rather spend for Netflix instead of Redbox Instant?

Give me a break!

[bzoum]

It's worst and worst for me !

Each time I contact Verizon support, they said to me "everything is OK from our part, see with your video provider" !!

I hate verizon. I will leave as soon as my 2 year agreement is finished !

It's a shame paying for 75mbits and not capable of watching my movies !

[ttutko1]

Surprised no one posted this yet but they completed a deal a couple days ago.

http://www.engadget.com/2014/04/28/netflix-reaches-another-isp-connection-deal-this-time-with-veri/?...

[SteveVi]

It was posted on one of the other Netflix threads in the FiOS forum.  While this is good news in the short term, it sets a horrible precident with far reaching implications regarding the future of the free internet as we currently know it. 

I can imagine all sorts of worse case scenarios where ISPs get to make decisions on which sites you can access based on thier own revenue extortion schemes. Whiile this first round of tolls revolves around video streaming, I wouldn't be surprized to see it happen for anything with potential for addtional ISP revenue; Too many ISP users using Google to search the net?  No problem, the ISP can cripple Google access and start backmailing them to pay if they want the ISP's customers to be able reach them reliably.

No good can come of this in the long term.