Non-Fios router installation
Patdi1
Enthusiast - Level 2

I recently replaced my Verizon With an Asus router to save on the monthly fee and better performance. At best, I am getting 33mbps download and 90mbps upload both wired and WiFi.  I have the triple play service with the  1 gig internet service.   The coax and Ethernet cable from the ONT - coax is connected to an actiontec moca 2.0 switch - ethernet is connected to the wan port of the asus router. Lan port of asus router is connected to the actiontec lan port.  It’s been 2 weeks multiple tech chat sessions with Verizon and the issue persists.

does anyone have a solution?  All help are appreciated.

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gs0b
Community Leader
Community Leader

If you have Verizon set-top-boxes, it is best to have a Verizon router as primary.  Verizon provides ZERO support for non-Verizon routers.  Verizon routers provide services that are required for their set-top-boxes and difficult to duplicate with a non-Verizon router.

If you want to save money on router rental, you can buy a Verizon router.  They sell new ones, or you can find used ones online.  If you buy used, I suggest the G1100 as it's a decent router that easily handles gigabit speeds.  WiFi range is good, not great.   You can turn the WiFi off and use another router as an AP, if you like.  Just make sure the seller has a fair return policy in case there are any issues (such as a Verizon marked unit with Frontier firmware.)

For more information on using your own router, review this FAQ:
https://www.dslreports.com/faq/14077

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gs0b
Community Leader
Community Leader

If you have Verizon set-top-boxes, it is best to have a Verizon router as primary.  Verizon provides ZERO support for non-Verizon routers.  Verizon routers provide services that are required for their set-top-boxes and difficult to duplicate with a non-Verizon router.

If you want to save money on router rental, you can buy a Verizon router.  They sell new ones, or you can find used ones online.  If you buy used, I suggest the G1100 as it's a decent router that easily handles gigabit speeds.  WiFi range is good, not great.   You can turn the WiFi off and use another router as an AP, if you like.  Just make sure the seller has a fair return policy in case there are any issues (such as a Verizon marked unit with Frontier firmware.)

For more information on using your own router, review this FAQ:
https://www.dslreports.com/faq/14077

Patdi1
Enthusiast - Level 2

Thanks for the response.  I have 2 Asus routers to be precise set up in a mesh environment to get good coverage throughout the house.  The main router is Th he RT-AC86U and the other is RT-AC1900P and The actiontec adapter is 1Gbps Bonded 2.0 MoCA.  I have TV Service with Verizon as well, I think I need that for the TV guide.  Hope this provides a bit more color.

thanks again.

Cang_Household
Community Leader
Community Leader

[Revised] You need the Verizon Router MoCA port for STB communication.

Other equipment on your network should generally be linked like this

1) ONT Ethernet -> RT-AC86U WAN

2) RT-AC86U LAN -> RT-AC1900P LAN

Just want to double check, you don't have any other MoCA adapters (e.g. Verizon Fios Extender/Adapter) right?

If you have more questions, please ask.

gs0b
Community Leader
Community Leader

@Cang_Household wrote:

I need to determine whether the Bonded MoCA 2.0 adapter from Actiontec is necessary. What is the model for your TV set-top box? If it is an older Cisco box, it does not use MoCA. If it is a newer box requiring MoCA, you need to disconnect the ONT coax wire from the coax spliter.


Incorrect.   All vintages of Verizon set-top-boxes use MoCA.  It is how they communicate to the Verizon TV infrastructure for provisioning, authorization, video-on-demand, command/control, and other data.  Without a MoCA connection to the router, Verizon set-top-boxes will not work.  It has been this way since day one of FiOS deployment.

Another error in this post is the suggestion to unplug the ONT from coax for a TV subscriber.  The ONT provides linear TV channels over coax.  Unplugging it will cause Verizon set-top-boxes to loose all channels and a host of other issues.

Internet only subscribers don't need coax connected to the ONT.  It is REQUIRED for TV subscribers.

Cang_Household
Community Leader
Community Leader

@gs0b

I am quite informed today. I was wondering for a long time why there is an option under the Firewall saying "Allow outbound Set Top Box Traffic."

image

You are correct. I just checked the Cisco Set Top Box Manual, it requires connection to home network either through MoCA or Ethernet. I am not sure how the TV works so probably gave wrong directions regarding the ONT coax port.

gs0b
Community Leader
Community Leader

You are correct. I just checked the Cisco Set Top Box Manual, it requires connection to home network either through MoCA or Ethernet. I am not sure how the TV works so probably gave wrong directions regarding the ONT coax port.


While the Cisco boxes were designed to support Ethernet or MoCA LAN, Ethernet LAN was never enabled or used by Verizon.  The old boxes must be connected to coax for both linear TV and MoCA LAN.  Linear TV comes from the ONT, MoCA LAN comes from the router.  The router, ONT and set-top-boxes must be connected to coax so everything works.

The newest FiOS ONE set-top-system has some more options.  The main box must be connected to coax for the same reasons as above.  The remote, or "mini" boxes are pure IP devices that connect to the main box over the LAN.  They can be connected by MoCA, Ethernet or WiFi.

But we've no idea what model of set-top-boxes the OP has.

Go check out the FAQ I posted earlier.  It will educate you on a lot of these issues.

Cang_Household
Community Leader
Community Leader

Hello, I have purchased a non-Verizon router too yesterday, looks like we are in the same boat. I am still waiting for the delivery though, I will update this thread in two days.

I purchased Cisco RV260 (no wireless, no PoE), so can I ask what's your Asus router's model?

The slow speeds you are getting can have a tons of reasons behind it.

1) Problematic MoCA Adapter/ONT coax port

I am actually not sure why you are using the MoCA adapter to connect between the Asus and ONT. If the ONT has an ethernet port, you can connect between the Asus WAN and ONT with an ethernet cable (at least Category 5e), no need to connect the Coax cable, unless you are using Coax LAN like me.

If you connect both ethernet and MoCA, the packets are going to collide between the router and the ONT, so slow speed. Unless your router and ONT can establish Link Aggregation (impossible?), the speed actually increases instead of decreasing.

Please specify the MoCA adapter model. There are a bunch of them. If the MoCA version on the MoCA adapter are different, they will communicate with the lowest version (and slowest speed). MoCA 2.0 has a rated speed of 500Mbps, Bonded MoCA 2.0 has a rated speed of 1.05Gbps. MoCA 1.0 has a rated speed of 100Mbps, MoCA 1.1 175Mbps... I have Verizon/Actiontec WCB3000N and ECB5240M at home (being loyal to Verizon, haha).

2) NAT/Firewall low throughput on Asus router

If your router has a low NAT throughput, which is very unlikely given gigabit equipment these days, you can have a slow speed. My yet-to-be-delivered Cisco has a NAT throughput of 800Mbps+, so it won't bottleneck my 980Mbps ONT output.

If you accidentally enabled the most restrictive firewall on Asus router or it is enabled by default, Asus router will inspect Internet traffic and slow down the connection to the rated Firewall throughput.

If you have more questions, please ask.

Patdi1
Enthusiast - Level 2

I removed the ethernet from the ONT to FIOS WAN and plug it into a PC and MAC same result, speed is the same as the ASUS connection

Cang_Household
Community Leader
Community Leader

@Patdi wrote:

I removed the ethernet from the ONT to FIOS WAN and plug it into a PC and MAC same result, speed is the same as the ASUS connection


That seems like an ONT issue or something is wrong with the incoming fiber connection. You would definitely want to test the speed from verizon.com/speedtest

I just tested mine, which is 850/884 Mbps

gs0b
Community Leader
Community Leader

Reinstall the Verizon router with Ethernet WAN to the ONT.  Remove the other router.  Run the Verizon speed test (https://www.verizon.com/speedtest/).  If the router speed test is well below 1Gbps, contact Verizon support.  That's the only speed test they will recognize.

You may want to start with their social media support team, as they can be more helpful than the typical support people.  Contact them through @Verizonsupport on Twitter or by posing in https://www.dslreports.com/forum/vzdirect.

gs0b
Community Leader
Community Leader

If you connect both ethernet and MoCA, the packets are going to collide between the router and the ONT, so slow speed.

Not correct.  The ONT uses MoCA WAN.  MoCA adapters and Verizon set-top-boxes use MoCA LAN.  They are two completely separate networks over the same coax.

Verizon routers have two MoCA ports attached to the same coax connector;  WAN and LAN.  LAN is used to talk to set-top-boxes and adapters, WAN is used to talk to the ONT.

Verizon routers have two WAN ports, MoCA and Ethernet.  They automatically determine which is active and use it.

Further, the ONT NEVER has MoCA WAN and Ethernet WAN provisioned at the same time.  Verizon routers are routinely installed with both coax and Ethernet to the ONT.  The Ethernet is used for the WAN interface, while the router uses the coax for the LAN connection to the STBs. The ONT also connects to the coax, as it provides linear TV to the STBs.  No MoCA WAN is sent over coax in this configuration.  There is no potential for packet collision.

Cang_Household
Community Leader
Community Leader

@gs0b wrote:

If you connect both ethernet and MoCA, the packets are going to collide between the router and the ONT, so slow speed.

Not correct.  The ONT uses MoCA WAN.  MoCA adapters and Verizon set-top-boxes use MoCA LAN.  They are two completely separate networks over the same coax.

Verizon routers have two MoCA ports attached to the same coax connector;  WAN and LAN.  LAN is used to talk to set-top-boxes and adapters, WAN is used to talk to the ONT.

Verizon routers have two WAN ports, MoCA and Ethernet.  They automatically determine which is active and use it.

Further, the ONT NEVER has MoCA WAN and Ethernet WAN provisioned at the same time.  Verizon routers are routinely installed with both coax and Ethernet to the ONT.  The Ethernet is used for the WAN interface, while the router uses the coax for the LAN connection to the STBs. The ONT also connects to the coax, as it provides linear TV to the STBs.  No MoCA WAN is sent over coax in this configuration.  There is no potential for packet collision.


I think the user which we are trying to help does not have a Verizon router at hand, so this is kind of a moot point. According to the user's setup, ONT Coax -> Actiontec Bonded MoCA 2.0 -> Asus LAN, this is a potential for collision if ONT and Actiontec is on the same frequency.

gs0b
Community Leader
Community Leader

I think the user which we are trying to help does not have a Verizon router at hand, so this is kind of a moot point. According to the user's setup, ONT Coax -> Actiontec Bonded MoCA 2.0 -> Asus LAN, this is a potential for collision if ONT and Actiontec is on the same frequency.

The point is the ONT has no active MoCA port.  By design, it does not have MoCA LAN port.  It's MoCA WAN port is not provisioned and is completely disabled.  There simply is NO POTENTIAL for collision here.

Cang_Household
Community Leader
Community Leader


 There simply is NO POTENTIAL for collision here.


Then, we need to resort to test Internet Speed at every branch point. For instance, disconnect everything from the main router except the WAN ethernet cable from the ONT, plug an ethernet cable from the main router LAN into a laptop supporting 1000Base-T, test the speeds here. If the speed is still slow, then something is wrong with the main router.