Significant drop in speed
chldudghks
Enthusiast - Level 1

I just finished setting up my own router, Netgear Nighthawk X8.. And I have gotten a significant drop in my speed.

The test was done on a desktop which was connected via LAN. I am getting 100/100 but I'm signed up for Gigabit. I was getting the gigabit speed with Verizon's Quantum gate router, but with my own router I'm not.. My WIFI signal was strengthened a bit(which I was trying to achieve with my own router, so that's good). I'm not sure what's going on..

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19 Replies
jonjones1
Legend

First the manual

http://www.downloads.netgear.com/files/GDC/R8500/R8500_UM_30Oct2015.pdf

Go to page 102 disable QOS it’s not necessary.

then go to page 111 check the status of the router. If all is well make sure it shows your dhcp is correct. (You did not use it prior to Fios gigabyte) if you did you must do a factory reset prior to hooking the Nighthawk up via ethernet WAN PORT

or is this device being used as an access point to the FiOS Quantum Gateway.?

mine works fine. However I used it with Time Warner cable prior and had to reset it first.

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chldudghks
Enthusiast - Level 1

I'm not sure if it is setup as an access point.. I do have a TV service as well so I have the Quantum Gateway connected to the X8 via Ethernet.

X8 was never used before, it is straight out of the box. I'll go through the manual. Thank you!

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jonjones1
Legend

Ah ha...I see...

access if using the Quantum should be ethernet coming from the ONT to the WAN port, the coaxial should be to the set top box from the Quantum router.

now you must login the Netgear Nighthawk www.routerlogin.net and make sure to set the Nighthawk to access point mode. It’s a simple flick on to activate it.

now take a ethernet line from the Quantum Gateway Router lan port and plug it into the WAN port on the Nighthawk. After this is done go into the Quantum Gateway and turn off all WiFi on 2.4 & 5 Ghz as well as guest network. 

Then access the Nighthawk and make sure WiFi is on and setup to be used.

thats where that manual comes in I sent the link for.

after it’s all hooked go to https://www.verizon.com/SpeedTest/instantinternet.aspx

and test the speed from a computer directly connected to the lan port and it should show the higher speeds. 

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chldudghks
Enthusiast - Level 1

Mmmmm just did it as you said, put Netgear as an AP but I'm still experiencing slow speed..

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jonjones1
Legend

@chldudghkswrote:

Mmmmm just did it as you said, put Netgear as an AP but I'm still experiencing slow speed..


The only thing I can think of is call Fios and see if you have been provisioned correctly although you won’t achieve 1024/1024 Fios does say speeds up to 940/880 so you should be pretty close to that. If not my estimate is Fios has not provisioned you correctly.

the set up in its self is simple. ONT-Ethernet cat 5e/6 to WAN port on Quantum router, then another ethernet cat5e/6 plugged into an available LAN port on the FiOS Quantum Gateway which is connected to the WAN port (not a lan port) on the Netgear Nighthawk R8500. You then make sure QOS is off on the Netgear Nighthawk and also insure it’s getting a signal from the Quantum since in access point mode it should be the Quantum is getting DHCP and the Netgear Nighthawk is simply handling the ip assignments and providing the better WiFi . That is why I said disable the WiFi on the Fios router. You don’t want overlapping signal to screw things up.

you must also turn off WMM on the Fios router as per my earlier instructions.

a good thing to do is to turn off the FiOS Quantum Gateway first and let it boot up fully. Then unplug the Netgear Nighthawk and count to 10 and plug it back in and wait for it to be fully operational.

if this is done properly you will get blazing speeds.

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chldudghks
Enthusiast - Level 1

DHCP is working fine, QOS is off and just ran a bandwidth test in the router setting and getting 500/400.. That's half the speed.. hmmmmm

This is slightly frustrating..

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smith6612
Community Leader
Community Leader

If you swapped the FiOS router in favor of your own, make sure your own router isn't using MAC Address Spoofing in order to appear as the FiOS router (usually for getting an IP without having to release the IP from your old router). This can have a performance hit on routers because spoofing the MAC means that all traffic must be sent to the CPU to be rewritten.

chldudghks
Enthusiast - Level 1

How do I find out if this is happening?

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jonjones1
Legend

@chldudghkswrote:

How do I find out if this is happening?


MAC clone address is in the manual link I sent you. But.....

if you have to ask if it is happening, then it’s more than likely not engaged.

you would have had to enter or copy the MAC to your router, and you did not do that.

chldudghks
Enthusiast - Level 1

I had like 2 hour long chat with a Verizon tech and they sent me a new router. And the problem has gotten even worse. 

on LAN connection, I'm getting under 100/100 and on Wifi, I get 15-20/15-20...

But when I do a router test on verizon.com/speedtest, apparently the speed my router is receiving is 1000/1000...

This is beyond frustrating.

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jonjones1
Legend

The only recourse is to go and use your own router. I use a Netgear Nighthawk R8500 

and it’s great. But expensive.

i cannot understand the fact it is showing advertised speeds on Verizon speed tests but dismal results in other tests. 

Now your router cannot be showing 1000/1000 it’s impossible. 

Again wifi tests mean absolute nothing. 

What device are you using to get the speedtest results?

it could and seems to show its your individual device that is defective. If you are getting a high within range speed from a direct lan connection to https://www.verizon.com/SpeedTest/instantinternet.aspx

then it is not the Fios speed results but the individual devices.

another question is why didn’t the installer test the speeds prior to leaving your home?

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chldudghks
Enthusiast - Level 1

No no.. When I do the router speedtest, I get like 970/950.. But when I do the device speed test, I get 100/100.

I'm doing to test on custom-built Windows 8 device desktop. And when the technician finished setting up, I immediately ran the speed test and was getting correct speed! But the drop in speed happened the day AFTER.

I will switch the setup tomorrow. Have the ethernet from ONT into WAN port on my Nighthawk X8, then a ethernet from Nighthawk X8 LAN port into Fios Quantum Gateway WAN port.

But again, I've already tried this setup and the speed was just as horrendous.

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jonjones1
Legend

Ah ha now we are getting some where. Device speed tests do not come near 940/880 because of hardware limitations and radios and lan cards or faulty operating systems.

the only speeds accepted which I have said numerous times is the “speed from your router to Fios proprietary speed servers” you have said you are getting correct speeds that way. Verizon Fios is giving you what you are paying for.

you will not achieve speeds up to 940/880 on a device test. 

So just leave your setup as it is. 

On my device test on my Apple iPhone and iPad it around 340/470 on my router to Verizon’s test site 940/920 most of the time.

just a closing observation I had cable internet and it was 15/1 and it was fast enough for everything my wife and I did online. When we went to Fios at 150/150 internet only we found most of our uploads were quite fast. Now with gigabyte it’s like we blink our eyes and it’s all done uploading and downloading is faster. But even if you are getting 100/100 on device testing that is still way faster than what cable internet offers. It may be 100/2 now up to 300/5 but again you cannot beat the speed of Fios 

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chldudghks
Enthusiast - Level 1

No way I'm going to say this is okay. Why would I pay for a gigabit internet when I'm getting 100/100 on a LAN connection..?

When I was paying for 75/75 on FiOS I was getting 65+ down and up.

Why would I pay for gigabit connect

and settle with 1/10th of the speed?

Not to mention I get like 35/35 on my iPhone X. I was getting faster wifi speed on my 75/75 than the gigabit

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jonjones1
Legend

@chldudghkswrote:

No way I'm going to say this is okay. Why would I pay for a gigabit internet when I'm getting 100/100 on a LAN connection..?

When I was paying for 75/75 on FiOS I was getting 65+ down and up.

Why would I pay for gigabit connect

and settle with 1/10th of the speed?

Not to mention I get like 35/35 on my iPhone X. I was getting faster wifi speed on my 75/75 than the gigabit


I would like to point out the speeds you mentioned 65/65 are not acceptable. On a75/75 your speeds should have shown over more like 70/73 so your speeds were not up to par.

i know that in your frustration you are not grasping the device speeds will never come close to a hardwired ethernet connection. If you are getting 100/100 on a device speed directly connected then it’s your device and not Fios. You have stated a ethernet connection to the router tested at Fios speedtest gets you those paid for speeds.

i can only say you either find a device that is top of the line (very very expensive) and then Test and at best it will be under WiFi at best half the speed. On ethernet it should come very close to advertised speeds. 

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smith6612
Community Leader
Community Leader

Try to avoid a Double NAT situation. Whatever router you want as your primary, be it the Netgear or the Greenwave (Quantum) router, the secondary router should be in bridge mode, or should have all services like DHCP/NAT/UPnP/IGMP disabled and connected using a LAN-to-LAN connection. There are guides on the Internet on how to configure your secondary router in a LAN-to-LAN configuration to ensure you're not killing network performance due to Double NAT.

Check your computer for programs like AMD QuickStream or Killer Networks' LAN software which can QoS or prioritize traffic. Even anti-virus software (Avast, McAfee, etc) which can scan network traffic can have the potential to slow things down. I would recommend removing software like this which may exist on your computer, to rule it out.

Additionally, try running a continuous ping to your router. Open a Command Prompt window and type "ping 192.168.1.1 -t". Make sure you see replies in the 1ms or less range. 2ms can be okay as well. Then try to speed test again. If you don't reach up to 1Gbps (940Mbps/940Mbps) - let's say you hit 100Mbps and you're running the ping test, ensure the ping continues to return in 1ms or less. If you see the latency shooting all over the place (10-50ms), or if you see requests timing out, there is probably something going on with your NIC, it's driver, or a physical piece of hardware up to and including the router which is causing a slowdown.

I would then try pinging 8.8.8.8 or another IP address in the same fashion. The idle latency will vary based on your location. But again - if you run a speed test and hit something like 100Mbps when you should be hitting 900+Mbps in both directions, ensure the latency is staying stable. If it spikes up or if you see timeouts, something isn't right.

This will help figure out if there's a bottleneck, provisioning issue, or if you have something like a duplex mismatch.

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chldudghks
Enthusiast - Level 1

I thought once Quantum Gateway is in bridge mode, it should be connected LAN(from my netgear) to WAN(on Quantum)?

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jonjones1
Legend

@chldudghkswrote:

I thought once Quantum Gateway is in bridge mode, it should be connected LAN(from my netgear) to WAN(on Quantum)?


The best way to hook it is the Fios Quantum Gateway Router as primary to get the connection from the ONT. Ethernet from ONT to WAN port on Quantum.

then you take your Netgear and plug it in and place it in access point mode (AP) then take a ethernet cable from the Quantum LAN port into the WAN port on the Netgear (not the LAN port) then once again make sure WMM is off on the Quantum and QOS on the Netgear. Then go into the Quantum and turn off all WiFi. 

This way you get internet through the Quantum (and still keep Fios support if needed) with the Netgear handling WiFi and ip assignments.

DHCP will be the only thing the Quantum will be used for.

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alaskajen616
Newbie

I have a Netgear R8500 Nighthawk X8 on Verizon gigabit internet plan, as well. Everyone's forum posts have been extremely helpful as I try to troubleshoot my own drop in speed issues. Here's what I figured out!

Using the Nighthawk by itself after the gigabit internet got turned on by Verizon, I was getting mid 300s on my mid-2010 Mac Pro over ethernet. I turnd QoS off and got high 500s. Spent an hour on the phone with Netgear with no improvement.

I decided to get the Quantum router from Verizon to do some testing. Using the Quantum router alone, I then got high 900s on a 2017 MacBook Pro over ethernet.

So I setup Quantum for no wifi and turned off WMM/QoS. Then I added Nighthawk in Wireless AP mode (bridge) with QoS/WMM off. (How to do this is laid out very clearly in this forum; thanks all!)

With the Quantum/Nighthawk setup, I was getting high 500s on the MacBook Pro connected to the Nighthawk via ethernet, while the router speed remained in the high 900s. Then I did a little research ... 

While it's true that you can use the ethernet ports on any Netgear router in AP mode, I didn't get gigabit worthy speeds on my MacBook Pro until I moved the ethernet plugs from the Nighthawk to the Quantum. Now my MacBook Pro and Mac Pro are getting high 900s (plugged directly into the Quantum). 

HOWEVER, wifi was still abysmal using the Nighthawk in AP mode. I was getting in the 20s (yup, 2-0) on my iPhone 8 Plus and iPad Pro 12.9". In the 100s on the Mac Pro. So I decided to scrap the X8 R8500 altogether. And now I'm getting at least 300s but more consistently 500s+ on wifi across all devices. And ethernet is still in the 900s up and down.

The only thing I didn't test the Nighthawk bridge config for was that double NAT thing someone mentioned. That very well could be an issue and when I've decompressed (or more likely after I can't get into one of our online games with our consoles!), I may revisit it. But for now, I'm rocking the Quantum. Note, the last time Verizon gave me a Quantum I gave it back within a month and bought the Nighthawk, so ... 

The Netgear X10 looks awesome, but Netgear's own rep yesterday steared me away from that one because "that one's also having speed issues." She recommended the R7000 ... She said that one's awesome; whatever issues it may have they can troubleshoot and fix no problem (whereas with the X8 and X10, it sort of is what it is; if you aren't getting giga speed they don't know what to do).

Hope that helps!

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