Baffled at DVR shortcomings

[Baffled]

Hi,

I'm not sure I expect any kind of a helpful response to this.  But, I am BAFFLED by the shortcomings of Verizon's FiOS DVR.  This product comes across as a beta offering.  This is not exactly new technology.  And, I would have thought that some things regarding the behavior of a DVR would be somewhat standard by now.  What gives?

An HD DVR with 18 hrs of storage???  And, no means to expand this with say an eSATA disk??  Does no executive at Verizon actually use this thing?  This isn't a "base model"!  And, I've heard nothing to give me reason to believe this is changing any time soon.

How do I skip to the end or the beginning of the buffer?  I can't?  Doesn't that seem like the 3rd or 4th function to add?  Someone should have said "Oh crap!  How did we leave that out?" and fixed it by now.

And speaking of the buffer.  DVR, I paused you because I want you to wait right exactly where I pushed the button until I'm ready to continue watching.  I'm still not sure just how long it waits; but all on its own it starts back up.  But, doesn't it start where I paused it?  No, of course not!  It jumps to the end of the buffer.  (Hmmm, maybe THAT's how I skip to the end.  I guess that would probably stll take longer than FF does.)  So, I'm watching a football game and need to step out of the room for 30-60 minutes.  I think I'll pause the game so I don't miss anything.  I come back to the room and Surprise!  Guess what the score is now!  I know I'll skip to the beginning of the buffer and work my way back to where I was.  Nope, can't do that.  I have to watch the action in reverse until I get to where I was!  Tell me.  When is skipping to the end (even when watching a non-sporting event) EVER the preferred action??  I don't get the logic here at all.  Okay, if you run out of buffer space before I get back, you may start playing again, where I LEFT YOU!  How is this not obvious??

Some of the more "minor" things we have noticed.  The "Last" button seems a little inconsistent, depending on whether you are recording something or not.  It should be easier to try and watch/monitor the shows on both tuners at the same time.  The audio and video occasionally get out of sync.  Oh, and we have experienced some of that notorious video dropout over HDMI.

Again, is this a beta product?  I love your HD signal.  But, your DVR really, really needs improvement.  Is it a copyright issue?  Would Verizon have to pay Tivo to use some of the more common-sense like functionality that they seem to employ?  Seriously, I just don't get it.

I am, Baffled

[KenAF]

It took many years for products like TiVo to reach their current state.

The Verizon DVR is relatively new, so it is unrealistic to expect the same level of maturity in the software.  Verizon continues to work hard on their software, so over time, they will eliminate bugs and improve functionality.  As far as recording capacity, an updated DVR model is expected early next year with at least double the storage.

If you can't wait for Verizon to improve their DVR, then you can always purchase your own Moxi or TivoHD.   These products require one CableCard from Verizon for $2.99/mo; this is an access card that plugs into the front of the box to authorize all of the SD and HD channels in your FiOS programming package.

[KenAF]

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@KenAF wrote:

It took many years for products like TiVo to reach their current state.

The Verizon DVR is relatively new, so it is unrealistic to expect the same level of maturity in the software.  Verizon continues to work hard on their software, so over time, they will eliminate bugs and improve functionality.  As far as recording capacity, an updated DVR model is expected early next year with at least double the storage.

If you can't wait for Verizon to improve their DVR, then you can always purchase your own Moxi or TivoHD.   These products require one CableCard from Verizon for $2.99/mo; this is an access card that plugs into the front of the box to authorize all of the SD and HD channels in your FiOS programming package.

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Correction -- CableCards cost $3.99/mo for new customers, not $2.99/mo.

[ksebruce]

Great post - I agree completely with everything you write about the DVR pause function - completely unacceptable. Another big shortcoming is that you cannot fast forward toward the end of a recorded show - it simply stops fast forwarding for the last 30 seconds or so of the buffer - baffling indeed. And don't get me started on the annoyingly large title bar at the bottom of the screen that comes up every time while you fast forward or rewind as well as the useless guide info. I'd like to record the new season of Curb Your Enthusiam but just gave up trying to setup a Series Pass because it wants to record the show everytime it airs, rerun or new.

[greyboy99]

Fantastic post.  I too agree with everything you write about the lack of a true DVR pause function, lack of "true" dual-tuners, the title bar that comes up every time you FF or REW, lame guide info, lack of true slow-motion, etc..  I've been with FIOS for over two years now hoping they would improve the DVR with basic features such as this but apparently it ain't going to happen.  I cannot for the life of me understand why more people have not complained about this, and I salute you for starting this thread.

I came from Comcast to FIOS in June 2007 and while I couldn't stand Comcast's business practices, I liked the functionality of their DVR a LOT more than I do the FIOS DVR (I can't believe I'm saying this).  C'mon: it's basically the same hardware (Motorola), but with different basic functionality - what gives?  I've told many friends who have debated switching to FIOS that if I knew more about the FIOS DVR before making the switch, I probably would have stayed with Comcast.  And, most of these folks are still with Comcast because they too like the Comcast DVR functionality too much to switch to FIOS.

I disagree that the Verizon DVR is relatively new and these things will eventually be addressed.  It is way overdue for basic DVR functions such as the ones mentioned above to be added, and I cannot for the life of me understand why more people have not complained about this. If I had the functionality of the Comcast DVR on FIOS, well, I'd be ecstatic.  But I don't, so that's why I am speaking up.

Something to think about, Verizon.

Thanks for listening.

Edit: as you can see this is my first post.  I'm mostly a lurker on these boards, and have been waiting years to find likeminded folks who feel the same way about the lack of these basic DVR functions.  Thanks again for starting this thread, maybe others will speak up too.

[Hbergeron]

It makes no sense to make excuses for a company the size of Verizon with a product like a DVR.  TIVO yes, but also RCN, Cox, and god-forbid, even Comcast have better DVR functionality than FIOS.  After waiting for years to get FIOS the relative lack of sophistication in the box software has already started me at least considering other options when my contract ends in a month.  On top of the big things, the boxes don't even have a sleep timer - something that is available in the firmware, but VZ engineers seemed to have let that one slip by too.  Maybe spend a little of the FIOS money to hire away a top software product manager (from Tivo, or heck, even Microsoft.)  It makes no sense to spend Billions bringing state of the art telecom tech to the houses only to fall apart in the last ten feet to your customers (or potential customers) eyeballs.

[KonaBob]

I totally agree - the single biggest problem with FIOS is the poor DVR functionality!  Everything else about FIOS is great - please just give me:

- the ability to skip to the beginning or end of a recorded show or live buffer,

- a way to stop the automatic "jump to end of live TV" after being paused for a few minutes, and

- a slow-mo/single-step feature that actually works properly, not jumping around at random, and not working at all near the beginning of a buffer.

There are several other details I would love to see corrected, but those are my big 3.

[KonaBob]

Sure would be nice if someone from Verizon chimed in here with:

• Yup, we're working on improving the DVR right now, or
• Gee, guess we should look into fixing this stuff, or
• Dude, that's how it is, and we ain't gonna fix it, or
• All of the above.

Failing that, can we at least get a couple of me-toos?  Does nobody really care????

[Reaper]

I think the FiOS DVR is fine. My only two major gripes are the lack of storage and the 4:3 IMG, both of which are reportedly being worked on by Verizon. PIP would also be nice.

I think that the other gripes mentioned here are minor, and they don't interfere with my viewing experience. If they did, I'd opt for a Tivo HD or a Moxi. But for the price, the FiOS DVR is fine as far as I'm concerned.

I do find myself sometimes missing the Dish Network VIP 722 HD DVR that supports external storage, has a true 16:9 IMG, and PIP. But overall my viewing experience is better with FiOS.

[majiksea2]

I agree, this thing has two (2), count em two USB ports and neither one works. The only answer you get is, Oh those are not enabled right now. Well the thing has NO storage. We can save anything, nothing. I love the service, love the picture, but sure miss my Dish Network DVR. I may have to buy a Moxi if they don't fix this soon, but I should not have to!!!!

[Tom_M]

The OP raises some good points, although I have to agree that Verizon is hard at work on the DVR functionality, but may be distracted by adding some of the flashier(I'm talking to you Twitter), more marketable functions than the real nuts and bolts that make a great DVR.

Here are some additional points I'd like to make.  I was previously a Tivo Series 2 customer, then had a DirecTivo, and then a DirecTV HR71, so I've seen some of the good and bad that others are doing in the industry. Verizon's DVR isn't the worst (the HMDVR is very cool), but it could be so much better.

1. As was said, 20 hours of HD content is simply not enough. Doubling that is a step in the right direction, but more storage is necessary.  Consider that DirecTV's newest base HD-DVRs holds ~100 hours of HD content.  
2. The ability to expand storage using an aftermarket harddrive (via eSATA or USB port) is necessary, especially when using the DVR as an HMDVR. 
3. Need to be able to modify end times on a program already being recorded. This is HUGE. One can modify a program start or end time before it starts somewhat easily in the View Schedule menu, but one it starts, you're stuck.  You can record as a series to pad the end, but this doesn't help if it's something like College Football which has 15 other programs with the same name that day. 
4. Inside the Series Manager, you don't have the option to see the upcoming schedule for a series you're recording. You can do this in the Guide, but it can be difficult to find a show this way. 
5. One should be able to manage recordings (record, set series, delete, etc) on an HMDVR from the client STBs. One can do this online and from a cell phone, why not from another STB within the home? 
6. HMDVR should be able to share content with a 2nd DVR both ways, ie a second DVR in the home should be able to act as a client STB.
7. This isn't a DVR function, but would be good nonetheless: Would be useful to expand VOD fast forward options.  Currently one can only fast forward at a 2X rate, which is very, very slow.  
8. Option to change 30 second skip to 15 or 20 second skip (so useful for baseball between pitches). Or change to a 30-sec Slip, like DirecTV.

If I think of more I'll post them.

[stevelogan1028]

I was reading in another thread that a lot of this is on Motorola and their inability to develop new software in a timely manner.  I also read that in early 2010, VZ is dumping the Motorola and switching to the new Cisco/Scientific Atlantic DVR.

I wonder how difficult it'll be for those of us stuck with this Motorola unit to upgrade to the newer one when available?

I really like you 8 points about the DVR with my most demanded being extra storage and your #5 - why can't I delete something on my DVR from my remote STB?!?  We have to remember which episodes of shows we've watched to delete them the following moring.  Of course, this wouldn't be critical if this unit had a reasonable amount of storage, but since we're constantly in the 90% full range it's a HUGE issue!