Port 25 HSI Emailing Issues

[KaLin]

This is a collection of threads regarding the Port 25 emailing issue.

[somegirl]

jimw1950 seems to have summed up the port 25 change pretty clearly, so unless you have more questions I'll leave that alone.

The verizon.net mail being blocked going to your hotmail account is completely unrelated to the port 25 change. Microsoft is blocking all verizon.net email right now. I have a post about this and the steps to take to report it to Microsoft here.

[darbeeny1]

I am wondering if this Port 25 issue is also stopping me from accessing hotmail via outlook using the outlook connector. ON Sept 1st MS stopped allowing outlook to get email directly from hotmail accounts and you had to install and run a MS program called Outlook Connector. It works VERY rarely from home almost like a specific port is blocked most of the time. In fact i tested my ports (I have VZ DSL) and found that a number of ports were blocked and some number of them changed with each test. That behavior is not unusal (you an see https://www.grc.com/x/ne.dll?bh0bkyd2) which runs the test and explains the issue.

Anyone seen this problem with Outlook connector?

PS: It happens on 2 different PC's in my house. It works from my office on my portable. I also put my PC in the DMZ and turned off all virus & firewall programs to test this all.

[SagCynthia]

I have used Verizon residential DSL service for years.  Until the last year, I've been fairly satisfied with their tech support, though it could be better.

Well, I don't know where I was supposed to get notified about not using port 25 any longer.  All I knew was my outgoing email stopped working. 

I use a third party email and mail servers and have for years.  The email I have always used is assocciated with my domain name, which is hosted at the same place that has the mail servers I've been using.  I checked with that ISP and he assured me he was not blocking port 25.  Not knowing about the changes, I called Verizon tech support - numerous times.  They insisted they were not blocking the 3rd party mail servers on port 25.  After many frustrating calls, I finally found on the Verizon site about needing to change to port 587.  Duhhh.  Way to go tech support.

To my unhappiness, they only support Outlook Express, which I don't like.  I use Thunderbird mail.  So, I called up to get support on setting up Outlook Express with the correct settings since it seemed I had no choice.  In the end, I was forced to use an @verizon.net email address for BOTH incoming and outgoing email.  Not only that, the reply-to address could not be set to the email address associated with my domain name.  As far as tech support has told me, there is no longer a way to use 3rd party email addresses.  Steaming more by the minute!

I'm outraged over this and want to change my DSL provider as soon as possible.  [edit] 

I've had it with Verizon.  Not only that, none of the techs were in the US, all had accents, meaning I had to ask what they were saying over and over again.

[bki1017]

I am writing with the utmost frustration with Verizon.    My husband, a 25 year IT veteran has now spent 6 hours on the phone with Verizon technical staff to attempt a remedy to this problem....but to no avail.   My company uses a third party mail server, and port 25 is my only option.  

Thus far, we have been disconnected three times, spent lengthy hours on the phone with technical experts who speak little or broken English, given 20 or 30 different reasons why this process does not work.  Then, they informed us we will have to 'pay for technical support' because this is past their level of expertise.   Well, the problem is one Verizon created, so it's really simple - JUST FIX IT!!

{please keep your posts courteous}- none of which will admit to the blocking of port 25 until my husband brings it up.     My number one priority is to seek out another internet provider ASAP.    This is the most appalling customer service fiasco I have ever experienced. 

[SagCynthia]

I'm sure there are millions of people who use email addresses that are associated with their domain name.  So, Verizon is basically making a decision to no longer serve those people.  Does not sound like a wise management decision to me.  I understand your frustration.  Wish there was a way to communicate our findings with each other.  They edited out my question as to whether someone knows an ISP who allows 3rd party email.

[ironfreehorse]

"I'm sure there are millions of people who use email addresses that are associated with their domain name."

I would love to find a way to continue using my email address.  So far, I have not been successful.

I don't know what to do.  I have been without the capability to send out emails since Sept. 16.  Nothing is working.  

I even resigned myself to using a verizon email address to reply to all messages, but that has quit working also.  It worked for a week or so and then suddenly has the same issues.  Tech support is hilarious at best, trying to keep a sense of humor about all this.  After 6 hours of them monkeying around trying all the same things I had tried, I have given up on using them.  

Help!  Anyone?

[bassgal]

I am using Thunderbird for my own domain mail  xxx@vinylux.com.  Verizon DSL is my ISP.  A few days ago I lost the ability to send outgoing e-mails.  I *had* been using my domain info for SMTP settings (outgoing vinylux.com, user name xxx) and port 25, but found that I needed to change it to get it to work.  Now my SMTP is set to outgoing.verizon.net on port 587 with my Verizon user name.  I haven't changed my incoming settings.  It is working fine and still shows my domain e-mail as my return address.  Hope this helps someone! 

[Bonnie_G]

Yes using "outgoing.verizon.net" instead of a third-party ISP was the trick for me -- and I discovered it myself (I'm so proud , because no techie knew why I couldn't send mail from my domain's e-mail.)

[VZ_Kevin]

Verizon Online has made changes to our dynamic DSL (High Speed Internet) network to further strengthen the security of our customers’ email messages and our network and to help prevent spam.

We have blocked incoming email from Port 25, which is the default port used by email programs to connect to email servers and to send email, for some time now. We are now taking the additional step of blocking outgoing e-mail messages from Port 25 to help ensure that our network is not used by spammers. Depending on whether you use a web-based email service or an email program such as Microsoft Outlook®, you may need to make changes to your computer settings to ensure that your ability to send email is not interrupted.

If you use a web-based Email service (either Verizon.net or a third party email service, such as Gmail, Hotmail, Yahoo, AOL, etc.):

• If you use a web-based email service to send your email, you do not need to do anything as our implementation of Port 25 blocking for outgoing email messages will not affect your ability to send or receive web-based email.

If you use a third party Email service such as Gmail, Hotmail, Yahoo, AOL and an Email program such as Microsoft Outlook:

• If you use an email service other than Verizon.net (such as Gmail, Hotmail, Yahoo, AOL, etc.) to send email through a program like Microsoft Outlook, you will need to make the following modification to your computer settings so that your ability to send email will not be affected:
Change the port number in the “Advanced” section of your email program from Port 25 to Port 587. Please make sure that you do not change your outgoing mail server. Detailed instructions on how to change the port settings on your computer can be found at www.verizon.net/port25.
• If you’re using an email provider other than Verizon.net (such as Gmail, Hotmail, Yahoo, AOL, etc.) to send email through your email program and you are unable to send email after making the change to Port 587, please contact your email provider for additional information on their recommended port settings.

[thisisnonsense]

Tech support at Verizon is outsourced off-shore. I had the pleasure of finding this out on 11-15-09... AND the help consists of reading off cheat sheets.  According to Verizon "In 2008, Verizon invested $344 million in training, and employees dedicated 11.7 million hours to training." For off shore outsourcing.  Not one of the people I talked to on 11-15 was sounded American, and did sound as if English their not first language, all were heavily eastern accents.

Here's the deal. If you connect to the internet via Verizon, and you run a website where you can receive and send email via the cpanel's horde or squirrel, via a client program such as Eudora or Outlook, VZ has your access to port 25 blocked. You have now been profiled as a spammer in Verizon's eyes. 

I have a website with cpanel email. The last email I was able to send a customer regarding account activity was on 10-12-09. I do have other options available to me to respond to customer service, but not for potential customers asking questions before they join. ALL email processed thru the site is subscription only, except for non-member's investigations. I cannot even email my server host with issues regarding the site. (And no, this is not my only method of communication with him) AND this is Verizon only right now. My server host uses a roadrunner group to access the internet, and he can send and receive emails via the site, or any site he hosts just fine. He has email accounts on several sites that he hosts just to make sure everything is copacetic.  We have argued this for 4 weeks now.  I have uninstalled, reinstalled eudora with reboots inbetween... I try to send an email, time out error 10060. Eudora's trouble shoooting is not up to date on this. With the so called VZ tech's assistance, I changed to port 587 in the eudora options. just a little tick box. Attempted to send an email. Access Denied error 10061.

Port 587 must be opened on the server level, check with your hosting service. And all this is going to do is open port 587 to additional hackers, spammers and trojans and worms. It is a bandaid fix. As soon as all the spammers go to 587... it will start all over again. Unless this port can put a tag on the spam and have the spammer arrested. its not going to stop the spammers, contrary to what VZ wants you to believe.   

All a locked door does is keep the honest people out.

Since I use Eudora to collect and send email from my website server…  This is issued from Eudora...  http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2476.txt 

[edited to remove copyrighted text]

Now let me direct your attention to this post at Slashdot…

http://it.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=09/02/17/1927213
Posted by kdawson on Tue Feb 17, 2009 04:06 PM

{please keep your posts courteous}

I don't have a zombie computer, I don't even use Verizon email, I have never even logged into my Verizon account. But VZ has deemed me a spammer.  But its amazing... I still get spam at hotmail, yahoo, gmail... but the only spam I get on my site, is someone attempting to sell me SEO or some off shore dropshipper wanting to partner with me. But those spammers have to go to my site to send a Contact Us email, which then records their IP, which then gets server banned.  

The spam I have gotten at my site consists of ip addresses that begin with 119.xxx.xxx.xxx; 221.xxx.xxx.xx and others coming from eastern europe, china, malaysia, and other asia pacific countries, middle east, and africa. (hmmm... I'm in the western US and my server is in Houston. And the last time I checked, Houston was still in America... Does that fit the profile of a spammer?)

And where is the outsourced customer service being sent?

And as soon as the new internet service is connected, its bye bye VZ ISP.

Please google Port 587 for more info on how this can affect the internet use. That is where I got the links I posted here.

[edit] this is part of a registered letter being sent to the CEO of Verizon.  

[spacedebris]

Well.....I can see what kind of response you are going to get.

Per the terms of service that you signed when subscribing to Verizon internet service, residential accts are forbidden to run or operate web servers and email servers. Residential accts are limited to personal internet use and since ports 25 and 80 are only used (supposidly) for business operations, they are hearby blocked on residential accts. Even if you manage to get around the port blockage issues, Verizon will then limit the number of emails being able to be sent out via a residental line. 100 emails per hour and 500 per day. Any more than this is considered spamming and will result in the suspention of your email services via Verizon. If you need the ability to host an Email or Web server, you are required to have a business acct.

So your complaint and the admission of the fact that you are running a server from your home on that registered letter, will likely result in your service being disconnected or suspended for violation of the terms of service that you signed. And you will likely be forced to upgrade to a business acct

Verizon farms out the tech support for dsl and dial up tech support. has for years. Most of it is handled in India but a lot in the phillipeans as well.  Only the FIOS tech support is US based.

---

Quote

The spam I have gotten at my site consists of ip addresses that begin with 119.xxx.xxx.xxx; 221.xxx.xxx.xx and others coming from eastern europe, china, malaysia, and other asia pacific countries, middle east, and africa. (hmmm... I'm in the western US and my server is in Houston. And the last time I checked, Houston was still in America... Does that fit the profile of a spammer?)

---

While most spam does come from offshore, there is a HUGE number of spammers that are based in the US. So location has nothing to do with spam. A spammer profile is any system that sends out a large number of emails. There are several huge blocks of IP address ranges from the US that are on the major blacklist systems for spamming.

[thisisnonsense]

[edit]

Where exactly did I say I was running a server from my home?  I lease server space from a hosting company. My home computer is not a server... Please make sure you have read things accurately.  There is a big difference in running a server and running a website. 

Obviously you didn't read the post all the way thru... 

[spacedebris]

---

---

@thisisnonsense wrote:

[edit]

Where exactly did I say I was running a server from my home?  I lease server space from a hosting company. My home computer is not a server... Please make sure you have read things accurately.  There is a big difference in running a server and running a website. 

Obviously you didn't read the post all the way thru... 

---

Where I got the information was the second paragraph in your post

Quote..

---

Here's the deal. If you connect to the internet via Verizon, and you run a website where you can receive and send email via the cpanel's horde or squirrel, via a client program such as Eudora or Outlook, VZ has your access to port 25 blocked. You have now been profiled as a spammer in Verizon's eyes.

---

Now you may not have ment that you host it at home, but that is the way it sounds.

Now if you are hosting a website elsewhere, via a hosting company, then your email will be sent from your server on THEIR systems, not yours and the issue is moot. The only reason an email would go across the verizon system, is if the email was originating from your computer. If it is orginating from your computer, your computer is then the server. In the eyes of the terms of service that is. If the email is coming from a server at a hosting site, then the port 25 block will not apply to you as the email is going across the hosting sites network, not yours.

[somegirl]

---

@thisisnonsense wrote:

Here's the deal. If you connect to the internet via Verizon, and you run a website where you can receive and send email via the cpanel's horde or squirrel, via a client program such as Eudora or Outlook, VZ has your access to port 25 blocked. You have now been profiled as a spammer in Verizon's eyes.

---

First of all, Verizon is not saying you are a spammer. The port 25 block is to help prevent spammers on the Verizon network. No one said anything about you specifically. It applies to ANYONE sending mail using a 3rd party account via a mail client.

---

@thisisnonsense wrote:

Port 587 must be opened on the server level, check with your hosting service. And all this is going to do is open port 587 to additional hackers, spammers and trojans and worms. It is a bandaid fix. As soon as all the spammers go to 587... it will start all over again. Unless this port can put a tag on the spam and have the spammer arrested. its not going to stop the spammers, contrary to what VZ wants you to believe.   

All a locked door does is keep the honest people out.

---

Yes, the email provider has to enable SMTP access via port 587 in order to use 587. The difference between port 587 and port 25 is that 587 requires authentication. Again, the idea is to cut down on spammers in Verizon's network. However, Verizon is only blocking port 25, so if your provider has a different alternate port, you can use that. (For instance, Gmail uses 465.)

The "locked door" in this case does what all locked doors do: Make it more difficult for those with less than honorable intentions to get what they're after. Believe it or not, *most* spammers (and thieves, unless they are after something specific) are more likely to move onto an easier target (network) if they encounter trouble.

---

@thisisnonsense wrote:

But its amazing... I still get spam at hotmail, yahoo, gmail... but the only spam I get on my site, is someone attempting to sell me SEO or some off shore dropshipper wanting to partner with me. But those spammers have to go to my site to send a Contact Us email, which then records their IP, which then gets server banned.

---

This type of block is exactly what Verizon is trying to avoid. Because Verizon assigns dynamic IP addresses, an action by one spammer can cause an IP address to be blocked, which is then re-assigned to a new customer. The new customer has done nothing wrong, but is blocked because they were assigned a spammer's previous address by the system. Blocks against Verizon are what this system was implemented to help avoid.

---

@thisisnonsense wrote:

We have argued this for 4 weeks now.  I have uninstalled, reinstalled eudora with reboots inbetween... I try to send an email, time out error 10060. Eudora's trouble shoooting is not up to date on this. With the so called VZ tech's assistance, I changed to port 587 in the eudora options. just a little tick box. Attempted to send an email. Access Denied error 10061. 

---

You have several options to resolve your sending issue:

1. Convince the owners of your email server to allow an alternate port. (Or use the one they have, if they already have one.)

2. Upgrade to a business-level account and get a static IP address from Verizon. The port 25 block is not implemented on accounts with static IPs, because the IP address is not reassigned.

3. Use the web-based email for your service instead of Eudora.

4. Configure your client to use Verizon's outgoing server for the 3rd party account. If you don't understand how to set this up, let me know and I'll try to walk you through it.

If you need more information, you can always visit http://www.verizon.net/port25

[somegirl]

---

@SagCynthia wrote:

@To my unhappiness, they only support Outlook Express, which I don't like.  I use Thunderbird mail.  So, I called up to get support on setting up Outlook Express with the correct settings since it seemed I had no choice.  In the end, I was forced to use an @verizon.net email address for BOTH incoming and outgoing email.  Not only that, the reply-to address could not be set to the email address associated with my domain name.  As far as tech support has told me, there is no longer a way to use 3rd party email addresses.  Steaming more by the minute!

---

Have you visited http://www.verizon.net/port25 yet? There are links on that page for how to configure clients for the change, including Thunderbird. The direct link to the Thunderbird configuration page is here. Where it says to use your Verizon information, you should be putting in your 3rd party authentication information if you are using their outgoing server.

When you say that the reply to address could not be set to your 3rd party address, why is that? Was it causing an error?  Did the agent just not know how to configure it?

It is possible that you need to be using a port other than 587, depending on your email provider's setup. (For instance, Gmail users need to use Port 665 and check the box, “This server requires a secure connection (SSL).”) 587 is the default "other" SMTP port and works for the majority of providers. Verizon is only blocking port 25 though, so if your 3rd party provider has another port to use, you might try that.

Hope this helps. If not, feel free to ask questions!

[SagCynthia]

---

@somegirl wrote:

Have you visited http://www.verizon.net/port25 yet? There are links on that page for how to configure clients for the change, including Thunderbird. The direct link to the Thunderbird configuration page is here. Where it says to use your Verizon information, you should be putting in your 3rd party authentication information if you are using their outgoing server.

When you say that the reply to address could not be set to your 3rd party address, why is that? Was it causing an error?  Did the agent just not know how to configure it?

It is possible that you need to be using a port other than 587, depending on your email provider's setup. (For instance, Gmail users need to use Port 665 and check the box, “This server requires a secure connection (SSL).”) 587 is the default "other" SMTP port and works for the majority of providers. Verizon is only blocking port 25 though, so if your 3rd party provider has another port to use, you might try that.

Hope this helps. If not, feel free to ask questions!

---

 I have visited the links you provided and in no way would Verizon allow the use of third party email address or mail server, even on 587.  The emails would always fail if using 3rd party mail servers.  Re the reply-to, this was reported back to me from my assistant who got help on the phone from Verizon to set up her email client.  The ISP for the 3rd party mail servers has no port requirements.  I've already talked to him about that.

What's outrageous is that Verizon techs swore up and down that Verizon was not blocking port 25.  If we can turn to them for REAL help, that's a pretty sorry state.  Even if they referred one to online information - but they seemed to not even know about the change and it's significance - or care.  Just got the canned "I apologize, but Verizon does not support...."

[SagCynthia]

I have checked out those links.  The isp whose mail servers I'm using has no special port requirements and is not blocking anything.

The reply to problem happened for my assistant and I'm out of town right now, so I can't answer that one.  All i know is Verizon's tech stepped her through these settings.

[somegirl]

Without knowing which ISP is providing your email, I cannot further investigate proper settings. As for the reply to address, there is NO reason why this setting shouldn't work, and it seems highly likely that the tech support agent that your assistant was working with simply did not know how to set it up properly. Since pop3 clients aren't *technically* supported by Verizon, most agents don't take the time to learn how to set them up.

[Bob_Robertson]

http://www22.verizon.com/ResidentialHelp/FiOSInternet/Email/Setup+And+Use/QuestionsOne/124274.htm

http://www22.verizon.com/ResidentialHelp/HighSpeed/Email/Setup+And+Use/QuestionsOne/124333.htm

[Rumpty2009]

I have used Eudora for years for several 3rd party accounts. They have been set to Port 587 for about a year with no problems. All accounts stopped sending today Sept 29, 2009. I cannot get Eudora to work at all.

I use Thunderbird for my verizon email and have been able set it up for one of my 3rd party accounts. The out going info is set with my Verizon account, but the return address is showing the correct 3rd party account information. So I can use my other accounts with Thunderbird.

I would like to stay with Eudora, any suggestions folks?

[drpelley]

My Outlook Express has been working correctly for years, and I chnged to port 587 BUT I am recieving 100 spam emails a day and cannot send email as it keeps telling me Verizon has determined my email to be spam. Do you think they are having major problems???  

Now I can't even get their webmail to work!     And tech support is awful!!