I hate this Thunderbolt and I can't take it anymore!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[rockula]

I'm a POWER phone user (but I don't root or jailbreak). If I want to watch a Youtube vid, it had better come up. If I want to sream a radio station, it had better buffer and play, when I want to check something out on a website, it had better come up for me. Otherwise, why not just buy a basic phone? I can do all this other stuff from home. But I don't have TIME at home. I only have time when I'm out and about. So...if my phone doesn't live up to the hype, It just makes me all the more angry. 

This Thunderbolt reboots all the time AND loses it's data connection, even after the update. I'm hoping Gingerbread OTA comes out today as planned.

But I have a theory as to why this is happening. 

I think It has something to do with the networks and Andriod and isn't specific to VZW or the Tbolt. My buddy now lives in a 4G market and never has any issues. He's with Sprint and has their Droid X equivilant. His phone will rarely and only reboot when he's in this area (Kokomo, IN) and he just got Gingerbread and says it really improved battery life. 

I drive 30miles one way to work. There are many routes I can take, but they are all rural. Kokomo is a hodge podge of crap networks. We're 3G, EV, 1x, etc. So nothing lasts long when driving as you'll drift in and out of the various networks all the time. And my phone will almost always reboot when I'm driving, and with no rhyme or reason, consistancy, etc. If it doesn't reboot (which I'm convinced isn't a heat issue either), it will at least lose it's data connectivity. Sometimes It comes back on, but most of the time I have to pull the battery. In the Driod forum, many others have said the same thing, and that a refurb replacement didn't help. So, I don't think it's the phone, but rather how Android handles networks.

I haven't checked... but do other Android phones reboot and lose data like mad? I was surprised when my non-VZW buddy told me his Droid X w/ Sprint rebooted yesterday. For a period of time after the last update, my data connection was fine, but rebooting startedh happening all the time. I don't think my phone rebooted once prior to the last update. My iPhone friends never talk about any of these issues... or any issues to be honest.

Which brings me to this... I was so excited to get this phone. It was my first Droid phone and I chose it over the iPhone only because I had plans on getting an iPad 2. I already have an iPod Touch. So I am stacked full of app's. If I'm in a 4G area, (which is hardly ever), the phone seem to peform fine. I came from a Blackberry Tour 9630, which I thought was the worst phone ever. But this one is JUST as bad, and one of the worst decisions I've made in a long time. I love many things about Andriod and this phone, but I spend more time in forums looking for solutions, (while holding back the desire to smash the phone to bits), than I do using it. I basically dream even using the phone anymore because it will always infuriate me at some point. One more ill-timed reboot is going to make me snap (It's not like my Blackberry, but not exaclty a fast booter either!).

And what stinks is that I'm stuck with it until the end of 2012! Plus, I've invested in an extended life battey and a skin. It's annoying how few aftermarket products are avail for this phone to be honest. Battery life is dreadful, so an extened battery is a must. God forbid Otterbox release a case that fits an ext life battery too. It's not going to happen. So, I'm stuck wiith skins, which is fine.

Also, the charge jack is located in the DUMBEST spot ever. Do you think I'll ever see a good cradle that allows me to watch movies or whatever in landscape mose while charging? I bet not. Yes, I know they make some, but none are any good. I quite simpley I hate this phone and regret buying it. I've been with Verizon for a LOOOONG time too. 

I went to the local store, and they are all really cool and nice, but acted like I was supposed to live w/ the reboots and loss of data. Someone there always grabs the phone and checks it out, making sure the settings are correct, and hands it back. I want a phone that works!!! God forbid they let me get a different phone. I'll even pay my insurance ded of $99 to get out of this phone.

If I call tech support, they are going to want to do my SECOND hard reset, which is a pain to get up and running again. My gmail addy book is dialed in, so I'm good there. But a hard reset won't work, because it doesn't work for anyone else. A refurb phone will do the same thing, and so will a new. Besides, I bet half of those refurbed phones are from rebooting problems anyway! If I march down to the VZW store, they'll tell me to wait till the OTA update hits to see if that works, which it might. But I've read that people who have rooted their phones and got the update say it's better, but still has some issues and quirks. I've been trying all day to get the update, but I bet that they haven't even released it. I need to check. Last time I got an OTA update, I had to get it in the middle of the night.

My point is.... i'm in cell h--- in this area. We are a 3G city, but if you go any direction out of the city, you start getting into to Centennial Wireless territory, and they are a giant thorn in the side to all major cell companies. They won't let go of a particular area and because of it, Kokomo will likely have ghetto 4G. At least for me, because I'll be far away from the tower. Plus, I live on the south edge of town. So, as I travel south to Indy, I'll have weak 4G, and then get into North Indy's weak 4G until I get closer to the city. Then it's FAST!! Good 4G service is unreal. I'm just regurgitating what a VZW rep told me. I'm just repeating it all back with some "hatred" mixed in.

So, I don't know what to do. Call Tech Support? Beg for a refurb that likely won't work? I could file an insurance claim since I have a legit reason. Sweat got under the display and won't go away. It's not bad, but it's not perfect. The people at the VZW store told me that I really need to get a Bluetooth headset, esp if I sweat a lot. I also put the phone in the crook of my neck a lot and talk while working. This almost always hangs up the call. Very irritating!!

They also told me at the store that if I go thru Insurance and pay my $99 ded, I MAY have a chance to talk them into letting me get a different phone of equal or more value but i'll have to really sell the idea. And if so, I'm going iPhone 4. Period. I don't think it's necc better than my Tbolt, but it's reliable, I have tons of app's for it already, and I'm a Mac user anyway. It just makes sense. Otherwise, there is NO CHANCE i'll be able to talk VZW into getting me out of this phone, even though none of these issues were present while I had the return policy. Only after did it start to do all of these weird things.

It sounds like I'm complaining about the Tbolt just to get the iPhone and I'm not. I'm upset because using my phone is a horrible experience as it's either slow, has a horrible connection most of the time when I'm driving, and is only useful on Wifi. Maybe a different phone will be no better and I'm just cursed to live in a bad market? VZW was supposed to the be the best though, so switching probl won't help me.

Not sure what to do exactly... so I will probl wait to see if anyone has any suggestions. I hate to be so negative, but I'm likely SOL, and that's really sad. VZW has been very good to me over the years, but i don't see how this will end well for me.

Jason

[vereyezuhn]

I'm not even sure Sprint has an equivalent to the DX. The phones are very different. Sprint has a lot of HTC phones - mainly comparable to the TB.

I hate to say it, but if you want a good reliable reception, you'll have to go with an old feature phone. None of the smartphones I've ever had have ever  had as good reception as my older phones (EnV3, EnV2, EnV, LG flip phones, etc)

My Droid X has good reception, I've never had problems not being able to connect to a call or dropping any calls or anything. The only reception problems I have are with 3G and my internet not working. My texts don't go through as much as they did on older phones as well.

[GreenRobot]

Man I felt your pain and after 3 replacement Thunderbolts I requested a different device. I got the Droid Charge and although it has some connection issues it is due to 4G but the issues are NOTHING like the Thunderbolt. I had the Droid X and loved it. It was a very solid device in my opinion. So if you can't take the Thunderbolt anymore just keep calling tech support everytime you have a problem and just let the VZW reps do whatever stupid crap they want to do till they have jacked you around enough that they fell they owe you a different device. It's not Android and Sprint is different than VZW in a lot of ways so don't think it's a carrier thing because like I said I was there once with the Thunderbolt and since I got the Charge I have slept a lot better. 

[jpoprock1]

My mistake. My buddy has Sprint, and has the EVO 4G. And he rarely ever has a reboot. He did just tell me the other day that when he lived in Kokomo, he turned 4G off. But now he lives in a 4G area and has it on. And when he came up to Kokomo for a visit, he got a reboot which surprised him.

SO... maybe it's an issue with any 4G phone handing off in a 3g or lower area, and depends on the towers themselves too?

j

[space1701]

---

rockula wrote:I'm hoping Gingerbread OTA comes out today as planned.

---

There was not an announcement of a Thunderbolt OTA upgrade to Gingerbread. The announcement was only for the Motorola Droid 2 Global

[jpoprock1]

Well, my comment was wrong in two ways, I realize. I was talking about two seperate things. I was talking about the "Patch" for Tbolt users that was to come out on June 15th, and the rumour that the Tbolt was going to be getting the Gingerbread update soon. I guess that's not happening soon, and neither is the patch.

But about all those Tbolt users who are applying the GB leak, both to rooted and unrooted phones?? The success rate is high, and I'm really considering it.

[shawnshine]

Don't throw out a perfectly good device. If your mostly in a 3G area you can change your settings and turn off 4G.

Check out my suggestions here:

http://community.vzw.com/t5/4G-Discussion/Thunderbolt-Reboot-Issue/td-p/536048 

Hope this helps you out. Good Luck.

[jpoprock1]

You know something ironic? I tried to respond to this using my Thunderbolt and the stock browser, and I couldn't type anything in this box! HA!! I'm doing this from the web.

Anyway, doing the *#*#4636#*#* thing did the trick. I'm now running CDMA (PRL), and only have had one reboot in two days. Usually I would have like 10. This totally confirms that it's something with the brains of the Tbolt that can't handle hand-off's on non-4G networks. In fact, in the past my phone would be in 3G mode, then when a 1x handoff needed to happen, my phone would either not hand off to 1x at all, or it would simply LOSE it's data connection. I watched my signal on my trip home yesterday, and it would easily switch in and out of 3G and 1X. As I said, I'm in "cell hell" here, so I bet I change from 1x to 3G at least 4 times in a 30 mile radius either direction.

So, for VZW store employees to tell people we'll be 4G before the end of year, is just a ploy to cell the new phones. Even if Kokomo goes 4G, it's only good if you never leave town! If half the state is still 1X, then what hope is there that most places will be 4G?

I don't understand, outside of sheer cost, what the problem is making 1x Towers 3G or 4G capable? Are these towers privately owned? Is it up to the owner to fork over the money? Why would they do that for the convenience of minority 4G users if 1X and 3G works "Ok"? It should be manditory. And there are towers ALL OVER THE COUNTRY, so I can only imagine the expense involved. But still, these companies have a responsibility to stay current. Otherwise, someone else will come along with a totally dialed in network and they'll lose business. I'm starting to think VZW is getting so big so fast that they can't keep up.

[AZSALUKI]

---

jpoprock1 wrote:

You know something ironic? I tried to respond to this using my Thunderbolt and the stock browser, and I couldn't type anything in this box! HA!! I'm doing this from the web.

Anyway, doing the *#*#4636#*#* thing did the trick. I'm now running CDMA (PRL), and only have had one reboot in two days. Usually I would have like 10. This totally confirms that it's something with the brains of the Tbolt that can't handle hand-off's on non-4G networks. In fact, in the past my phone would be in 3G mode, then when a 1x handoff needed to happen, my phone would either not hand off to 1x at all, or it would simply LOSE it's data connection. I watched my signal on my trip home yesterday, and it would easily switch in and out of 3G and 1X. As I said, I'm in "cell hell" here, so I bet I change from 1x to 3G at least 4 times in a 30 mile radius either direction.

So, for VZW store employees to tell people we'll be 4G before the end of year, is just a ploy to cell the new phones. Even if Kokomo goes 4G, it's only good if you never leave town! If half the state is still 1X, then what hope is there that most places will be 4G?

I don't understand, outside of sheer cost, what the problem is making 1x Towers 3G or 4G capable? Are these towers privately owned? Is it up to the owner to fork over the money? Why would they do that for the convenience of minority 4G users if 1X and 3G works "Ok"? It should be manditory. And there are towers ALL OVER THE COUNTRY, so I can only imagine the expense involved. But still, these companies have a responsibility to stay current. Otherwise, someone else will come along with a totally dialed in network and they'll lose business. I'm starting to think VZW is getting so big so fast that they can't keep up.

---

verizon has the largest network. they have the fastest network. what more can they do? yes, they focus on major markets, but that's because that is where they make money. they aren't a public utility. they are a for profit corporation. their coverage speaks for itself. they pay WAY more attention to the rural areas than any other carrier.....but it's just bad business to throw ten towers in a spread out rural area that will cover a few thousand people....when they can use 9 of those towers in an area that will cover 200,000 people. their LTE network is 10 times faster than sprint's "4g" and they are banking on domintaing the market with it, just like they did with 3g. keep in mind that they launched the first LTE areas only 6 months ago and this is still very new technology.

for the record though, i mostly keep mine in 3g right now, as it is much better on my battery. i switch it to 4g if i'm not near wifi and want to browse or download something. i'm in a strong LTE network and i do believe this LTE network will blow the other carriers out of the water. my 3g incredible speed tests at the same rate as my friends' EVO's on sprint's "4g" netowrk. (just under 2 mbps). no reboots, but i didn't install they update back in may.

[jpoprock1]

Yeah, I can't argue with ya. That's why I've always been a VZW customer. Their network is great, but not so hot in my area. Sure there are towers in rural areas, but those are always the last to get updated. And if you look on the map where I live, and where I travel... i'm not asking for much! It's not like I live in Southern Indiana where you have to travel by hot air balloon to get from town to town! I live Kokomo, and drive southeast to Elwood every day. South of Kokomo is Noblesville, which is 4G and is only 20min away. But it's of course closer to Indy, which is 4G. Beyond Kokomo, there isn't much. But due west is Lafayette, home of Purdue Univ. I'm not sure if they are 4G, but they should be simply because of the university. To the East of me is Gas City and it's an hour away. So, the "band" that I live in is sort of a weird area for sure. And I'm sure the goal for VZW for all towers to be 4G. My point is, there are still TONS of 1X towers around and we're now on 4G. It could be YEARS before those are 4G, and by then, it'll be something else, and then those towers will be lagging.

I have no clue how a tower works. But you'd think that the brains of each and every tower could be "flashed" by Verizon once they all have the right equipement to do so. That would be great. VZW could just beam a signal and immediately upgrade their networks. But I'm sure it doesn't work that way.

I should go to the Speedtest.net site and check my speeds in various places. I've never done that on a cell phone.

I will say that a good strong 3G signal is pretty fast for me. And when I get the chance to be on a 4GLTE network, it's darn near Wifi speeds. Very impressive! So, it's frustrating when you live in an area that is SO CLOSE to other 4G markets, and you don't have it, and you don't know when you ever will!

[AZSALUKI]

jpoprock1....there's an app called speedtest.net......you can use it. you don't actually go the site from your phone, but just use the app....if you're curious as to what kind of speed you get. i get 1.5-2mbps download speeds on 3g in phoenix. my dsl at work is about 7mbps and my cable internet at home is about 10mbps. my LTE is consistently 20+mbps....lol. it's pretty ridiculous. however, there are sites that get hung up when i try to access them on 4g....particularly (and ironically) google. there's a few others too so i usually leave it on 3g.

[jpoprock1]

Well, I can pick one that has helped me the most. But really, there IS no solution to my issues. Not yet anyway. A solution would have to come by way of a VZW update. And only until I don't get 3-4 reboots a day will I be satisfied.

So, do I take away from all of this that the issue is specific to the Thunderbolt, not all 4G Androids. SInce I don't live in a 4G area, I can turn 4G off. No biggie. That actually HELPS. So, is it the PHONE in 4G/CDMA mode that is causing the bad handoff's, or is the problem with the towers in my area, or both?

In other words: living in the area that I do, is there a good 4G phone that will run fast on 3G and not reboot and drop data connections all the time? I'm sorta regretting that I didn't get the Droid X or the Incredible. My friends that have those phones have nothing bad to say about them. But they are 3G phones, not 4G. Maybe my mistake was buying the "very first VZW 4G phone" when it came out, rather than waiting until they worked out the bugs for other 4G phones.

Thanks

[mjay]

how do you spell class action law suit the lawyers smell blood in the water

[jpoprock1]

For the record... I'm not going to just "throw out" my phone. I'm willing to wait it out a bit though. I have yet to call VZW about the problem, because I already know what to expect. They'll want me to do a hard reset, and we all know that won't do anything. So why waste the time doing that?? If they were willing to just cut to the chase and send me a new device, or even a refurb, that would be great. We all know that the refurb will do the same thing as the one I have now, so if I end up going thru 4 or 5 refurbs chasing a known problem... maybe THEN they will let me get a different phone.

I would prefer to stay with Andriod, but I'd like to get the show on the road either way. I want to buy a BlueTooth headset for my device, but maybe If I knew I was going to get a different model, I would choose a particular BT device? OR maybe it wouldn't matter? I also would like to apply my Bestskinever skin,but not if I'm going to send this phone back. And then if I go thru a bunch of refurbs, applying the skin would be a waste (they are only like $8.99, but still).

All I want is a device that works that I can enjoy, get my skin/case/BT established for, and be happy.

If the iPhone battery life is horrible, and hard to swap out, then I wouldn't like that either. Although, I am a Mac user... so I could dock it while I'm at work no problem. I would have to have the largest capacity iPhone, which would be salty. And I don't want a white one.

Can AT&T iPhone 4's be made to work with Verizon if they are jailbroken? My buddy has one w/ AT&T and wants to get a new phone. So he'd sell me his for cheap I bet. However, I don't think it will work on the VZW network without a bunch of hassle.

[vereyezuhn]

---

jpoprock1 wrote:

For the record... I'm not going to just "throw out" my phone. I'm willing to wait it out a bit though. I have yet to call VZW about the problem, because I already know what to expect. They'll want me to do a hard reset, and we all know that won't do anything. So why waste the time doing that?? If they were willing to just cut to the chase and send me a new device, or even a refurb, that would be great. We all know that the refurb will do the same thing as the one I have now, so if I end up going thru 4 or 5 refurbs chasing a known problem... maybe THEN they will let me get a different phone.

I would prefer to stay with Andriod, but I'd like to get the show on the road either way. I want to buy a BlueTooth headset for my device, but maybe If I knew I was going to get a different model, I would choose a particular BT device? OR maybe it wouldn't matter? I also would like to apply my Bestskinever skin,but not if I'm going to send this phone back. And then if I go thru a bunch of refurbs, applying the skin would be a waste (they are only like $8.99, but still).

All I want is a device that works that I can enjoy, get my skin/case/BT established for, and be happy.

If the iPhone battery life is horrible, and hard to swap out, then I wouldn't like that either. You have seen an iPhone haven't you??? There is no removable battery without voiding the warranty... Although, I am a Mac user... so I could dock it while I'm at work no problem. I would have to have the largest capacity iPhone, which would be salty. And I don't want a white one.

Can AT&T iPhone 4's be made to work with Verizon if they are jailbroken? No, Verizon and AT&T run on 2 different networks, and the phones are not interchangable. My buddy has one w/ AT&T and wants to get a new phone. So he'd sell me his for cheap I bet. However, I don't think it will work on the VZW network without a bunch of hassle. No, It won't work at ALL. Hassle or not, the phones are simply not compatible

---

From this post, it sounds like you're just trying to dump your TB for an iPhone 4.... Don't let Verizon reps know this, as this is a huge issue with them. Everyone and their brother is doing everything they can to get their hands on an iPhone 4, and Verizon knows it.

[jpoprock1]

Yes, I know all about the iPhone in great detail including the non-removable battery. But as I said, mine would likely be docked most of the day anyway, so It would always be charged.

And I only reference the iPhone because many of my friends either have those, or the Droid X or Incredible. I will say that MANY of my iPhone friends have shown Thunderbolt envy. Anyway, I reference the iPhone only because my friends that have them don't have any problems. The only reason they like my phone is because of the screen size. Personally, the iPhone display looks just as good, but it is smaller.

It DOES sounds like i'm trying to ditch my Tbolt for an iPhone, but honestly that is not my intention. I have a lot invested in this TBolt, so switching would be silly. I just want my phone to work. I got a whiff from the people at the local VZW store (who are SUPER cool to me), that it's virtually impossible to move from the Tbolt to an iPhone. That it's a very sensitive issue with them, and I'm not sure why. Probl because VZW doesn't make as much profit on iPhones.

Like I said, I just want to enjoy and trust my phone, and I can't. I hate it that it reboots all the time, and sometimes in my pocket it will suddenly get really hot and I'm not sure why? I'm going to send it back for a refurb, but I expect the same problems over and over. That's what bothers me the most.

[GreenRobot]

---

jpoprock1 wrote:

Like I said, I just want to enjoy and trust my phone, and I can't. I hate it that it reboots all the time, and sometimes in my pocket it will suddenly get really hot and I'm not sure why? I'm going to send it back for a refurb, but I expect the same problems over and over. That's what bothers me the most.

---

God man don't send them your perfectly flawed Thunderbolt for a refurb. If you hate your Thunderbolt now you will want to go postal on the refurb. Just hold out for the next update and hope it gets better. Refurb is a terrible idea...

[jpoprock1]

Well here's the sitch... my display is ruined by sweat. It was horrible at first, but now it's settled down to as good as it's going to get. It's acceptable, but "unacceptable" in that I have a "non-perfect" phone. I was told that since it was caused by sweat, it's not a warranty issue and that I'd have to pay $99 to send it in as an insurance claim. I was also told they would send me a brand new phone because it was an insurance claim. But then I also read that may not neccassarily be true either. That I could still end up with a refurb. I'm not going to pay $99 for a refurb. I'd rather not mention the bad display and focus on the rebooting to get another, for free. If I were guaranteed a BRAND NEW PHONE for $99 then I'd likely do it. And if I could talk them into letting me change models for something of similar value (they told me at the VZW store that if I plead my case just right, and requested a phone that made sense, they'd likely do it). I'd likely try to get the Droid Charge or maybe the Incredible 2 if it's out. (and yes, I'd take a stab at getting an iphone first=).

[GreenRobot]

---

jpoprock1 wrote:

Well here's the sitch... my display is ruined by sweat. It was horrible at first, but now it's settled down to as good as it's going to get. It's acceptable, but "unacceptable" in that I have a "non-perfect" phone. I was told that since it was caused by sweat, it's not a warranty issue and that I'd have to pay $99 to send it in as an insurance claim. I was also told they would send me a brand new phone because it was an insurance claim. But then I also read that may not neccassarily be true either. That I could still end up with a refurb. I'm not going to pay $99 for a refurb. I'd rather not mention the bad display and focus on the rebooting to get another, for free. If I were guaranteed a BRAND NEW PHONE for $99 then I'd likely do it. And if I could talk them into letting me change models for something of similar value (they told me at the VZW store that if I plead my case just right, and requested a phone that made sense, they'd likely do it). I'd likely try to get the Droid Charge or maybe the Incredible 2 if it's out. (and yes, I'd take a stab at getting an iphone first=).

---

That makes more sense for a replacement then but stop mentioning the screen to vzw. If they say you need a replacement for your reboots or heating up then let them send a free one. As for switching to another phone I have done that, I went to the Charge from the Thunderbolt. I do like it better than the Thunderbolt because it works and it doesn't do weird stuff all the time but it is a 4g phone and you're still going to have low battery life ( compared to 3g ) and connection issues especially if you're not in a 4g area. My opinion is get switched out for a nice new 3g phone and wait for a 4g once you have it in your area and the kinks are worked out. 

[Karuk]

I received a CLNR last friday because the verizon techs told me I needed a new device. The CLNR looked fine but it had the soft power button (no click). About an hour after receiving the CLNR my phone started working on 4g again after 12 days of no 4g service.

I'm keeping my original phone because it is better than the CLNR.

If y ou take a CLNR be sure you inspect the device and use it for a couple days. If you find even one issue I suggest y ou return it. Make sure you get a solid refurb.

[GreenRobot]

---

Karakul wrote:

I received a CLNR last Friday because the Verizon techs told me I needed a new device. The CLNR looked fine but it had the soft power button (no click). About an hour after receiving the CLNR my phone started working on 4g again after 12 days of no 4g service.

I'm keeping my original phone because it is better than the CLNR.

If y ou take a CLNR be sure you inspect the device and use it for a couple days. If you find even one issue I suggest y ou return it. Make sure you get a solid refurb.

---

Once you start the cycle it seems to never end because every refurb you get will be under a microscope. Seriously if your original has no physical damage I would keep it. Getting and sending back refurbs is a pain and a liability. One of the main reasons I took a Charge is because I was so sick of talking to VZW reps, doing resets, and setting up phone after phone.