2G/3G being snuffed out 1 Jan 2020 to make way for 4G LTE causing many problems.

[cmoo]

CDMA Network Retirement

As we complete our network transition to 4G and 5G, we at Verizon would like to keep you up to date with some important activities.

We are moving all devices to our HD Voice LTE network, which offers superior coverage and performance compared to previous generation networks.  Starting January 1, 2020, Verizon will no longer allow any CDMA (3G and 4G Non-HD Voice) 'Like-for-Like' device changes.

My Letter to Verizon

Verizon Wireless

Correspondence

P.O. Box 291089

Colombia South Carolina 29229                                                            8-23-19

A corporate oversight is about to cost Verizon thousands of dollars annually and countless prepaid customers.  Customers will be forced to switch to other cellular providers as Verizon streamlines into a virtually smartphone only option as it moves forward with the upgrade to 4G LTE.  Phasing out of 2G/3G phones and services will in essence phase out the customers that either can’t afford or dislikes smartphones.  My cell is 3G and Verizon will stop serving it in 2020 which is right around the corner.

     Many consumers that are fed up with contracts, smart phones plagued by poor battery performance and the cumbersome task of going thru screen after screen to perform simple communications task and will be fleeing from Verizon’s rolls by the thousands.  And, it all has the appearance of a well thought out plan by Verizon decision makers. If getting rid of the Prepaid Sector of the operation was the goal then it is definitely going to work!  

     Take me for instance, I have three separate Verizon Accounts paying for three different prepaid phones. The methodology doesn’t reward me for this, but I’m a loyal customer and have tolerated the harassment and disappointment until now.  What harassment you ask?  Prepaid has its own Customer Service (CS) section where you’ll be late for work waiting on someone to answer. There is a chat option if you are logged in, but there’s a horrendous wait there as well.  When a CS tech does respond they are usually handling more than one customer simultaneously.  It appears there is a time limit not to be exceeded that’s driving their actions and not the issues of the “paying Customer”.

  Anyway, back to my three phones. My preferred phone is the LG Cosmos slider. I’ve had it for five years; it’s taken a beating, still works, doesn’t do data,  but has the 3G curse.  Next, is the Samsung S7 Smart phone, the “sissy phone” that sets on my desk an does the data. Has to stay on the desk cause if you look at it hard the screen protector cracks (like the one that’s on it right now).   Third is the Samsung Slider Smart phone that I provide for a family member; simple to use and they like it.  That’s about to change because we’ll have to learn to use another phone now; Verizon is not user friendly and doesn’t reciprocate loyalty back to its customers.   

Now, after wasting my time calling and chatting with several CS Techs it’s apparent that the preferred path to 4G LTE is to sign a Verizon contract, buy a new phone from them and hope that it works satisfactorily.  If it doesn’t then you’ll have to take a lot of time out of your busy schedule to deal with the CS Techs. 

Back to my dilemma, the Prepaid section on the Verizon website has 36 phones to choose from and they are all Smart phones except for one flip phone. And yes, there are more phone options “in the contract phone section”. 

     There is no way to determine if the “Bring Your Own Device (BYOD)” program is a viable option.  When asking about BYOD the first question from the CS Tech is “What’s the IME#?”  News flash, ya have to by the phone to get the IME#.  As much money as Verizon has made off its customers one would think they would provide a list of acceptable (non-Smartphone devices) or something to the multitude of customers they’re about to lose to make this a seamless transition to the 4G LTE platform, but that didn’t happen.

     As for folks like me looking to upgrade now to be ready for the transition only to find that one does not exist, we, in the Verizon Prepaid Hemisphere have limited options.  1) signing a contract which is not an option; 2) Going with one of the competing cellular companies that offer Prepaid; 3) Getting a Tracfone or 4) Going back to a landline. Looks like we’ve gone full circle. Folks left the land line, because a cell phone was cheaper, now we’ll go back to it because a Smartphone cost much, much more…

[Kancha45]

Its year of 2019 who uses flip phone, maybe 1% of verizon customers. Stop complaining. You gotta terrible it up. Just buy new smart phones they are good in battery performance. Its like a cup of cofee if u finance via carrier. I love HD voice technology. 

[Benitez147]

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@Kancha45 wrote:

Its year of 2019 who uses flip phone, maybe 1% of verizon customers. Stop complaining. You gotta terrible it up. Just buy new smart phones they are good in battery performance. Its like a cup of cofee if u finance via carrier. I love HD voice technology. 

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shhhhhhhhh your fingers. Just because you don't like flip phones doesn't mean no one else does. I still have a small flip phone on my account for $9.99 a month and it works good. I don't like holding bricks in my ear Koncha. Maybe you like that, but I sure don't.

[jchssr51]

I personally like my "Flip Phone" and NOT every one WANTS a Smartphone!!! I don't want one even if I have to go to one. I can operate one just don't want it. All I want my Flip Phone for is in emergencies while traveling down the road. I still use a land line myself. Different strokes for different folks is what I say!!!!!

[mama23dogs]

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@jchssr51 wrote:

I personally like my "Flip Phone" and NOT every one WANTS a Smartphone!!! I don't want one even if I have to go to one. I can operate one just don't want it. All I want my Flip Phone for is in emergencies while traveling down the road. I still use a land line myself. Different strokes for different folks is what I say!!!!!

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So get one that's VoLTE .  Last time I looked Verizon had 5 flip phones on its sales pages 

[Katsmuggins]

Hey I have a smart phone through T-Mobile but I use a Verizon flip phone when I don't have service on my smartphone for Telecom calls because I'm a truck driver no reason to pay twice as much or $100 when the dang basic phone which I need it for is only $35 non prepaid to go that route T-Mobile is getting better and I'll just say f*** Verizon

[CommunityName20]

I'll tell you one type of person who still uses a flip-phone - or more accurately, a "feature phone" - people who are technical enough to design, build and maintain the infrastructure which provides the service you're using with your "smart"phone.  We know the technical capabilities of various phone types, and know that radio-frequency performance was sacrificed in favor of computer software in the "smart"phones.  Those of us who need our mobile telephones to function as a mobile telephone often choose "feature phones" because they're optimized for voice.

Here's another type of person who still uses a flip-phone ("feature phone"):  People who value their privacy and don't want to spend all day reading up on the security patches and workarounds for the latest malware threat.  One such person is Warren Buffet, "the Oracle of Omaha." He's wealthy enough to always carry the latest iPhone release, but he chooses a secure flip-phone instead.  He has tech advisors who keep up with telephone tech, so it's not like he's making that choice based on ignorance or lack of technical expertise.

I'll offer another example of a type of person who still uses a flip-phone: People who don't want to risk "butt-dialing" anyone, and those who have had to replace a few glass screens before deciding that a flip-phone fits their lifestyle better.  There are other types of people who choose to remain flip-phone users, but I will not belabor the point.

As for your rather arrogant and off-putting demand that people just accept the lack of choice being forced down their throats, I'll hazard a guess that you're a collectivist who feels strongly that people must saunter with the herd rather than climbing their own peaks.

[elkrosi]

I'd like to get a 4G LTE SYM card for my 2G Samsung Gusto 3. I don't care if I can only make, receive calls and talk. I don't care it it slow. My local Verizon store says this is not possible.

[mama23dogs]

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@elkrosi wrote:

I'd like to get a 4G LTE SYM card for my 2G Samsung Gusto 3. I don't care if I can only make, receive calls and talk. I don't care it it slow. My local Verizon store says this is not possible.

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Your Sim card is not the problem. Your phone is not capable of working on LTE because it does not have LTE hardware in it.   That phone will not work anywhere in the United States because all carriers are shutting down 2G and 3G service. Your local Verizon store was absolutely correct.  
    

[mama23dogs]

Every flip phone Verizon sells now (they have 5) is compatible and will work after January 1.   https://www.verizonwireless.com/basic-phones/

You do not have to leave prepaid.  And there are no contracts.  All carriers stopped offering them

[alwalker]

Yeah but the old phone will no longer work and I can not get the same cheap deal under the new prepaid plans that these phones use.  For years I just added minutes to the phone when I needed it and did not have a monthly charge.  Since I don't text and only made calls when necessary 30 dollars worth of time would last me for 6 months sometimes. 

I realize that only one percent of the Verizon customer base used 2g cdma and they need to charge me a lot more than they are making to generate the millions in profit they already make every year.  It would be a shame for people like me to continue to get what we have needed in a phone all these years--a simple way to occasionally communicate and nothing else.

That said, when cdma is terminated I will also be leaving for Consumer Cellular.  The pricing is better than Verizon if you're going to have to change now anyway.

[mama23dogs]

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@alwalker wrote:

Yeah but the old phone will no longer work and I can not get the same cheap deal under the new prepaid plans that these phones use.

huh?   You can buy a new flip phone, Verizon has 5, and swap your service, and keep your plan.   What make you think you can't just get a new flip?

Not logical

[Moreaggravated]

I'm with you.  I have had a Samsung Gusto since 2011, I pay $100 a year and use it for emergencies.  I have $750 credit but will not be going with a smart phone to use that up but change to another carrier as even losing that credit it is cheaper over 2 years!

[crstrohmeyer]

Ditto; I had a Cosmos Slider that I was very happy with.

I was forced to go with clunky Sonim XP5 that is not a logical "dumb" phone and is very difficult to use and next to impossible to text with. We have 6 lines with Verizon, most are smart phones, but the blockhead that run Verizon have now likely lost us as a customer unless they make this right

[mama23dogs]

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@crstrohmeyer wrote:

Ditto; I had a Cosmos Slider that I was very happy with.

I was forced to go with clunky Sonim XP5 that is not a logical "dumb" phone and is very difficult to use and next to impossible to text with. We have 6 lines with Verizon, most are smart phones, but the blockhead that run Verizon have now likely lost us as a customer unless they make this right

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For the sake of one phone?  Ad go where?  No one has QWERTY phones anymore

[teeshot]

I hope you copied this letter to all carriers all over the world.  Do a search, everyone is taking the same steps although the timing varies over the next few years.  Do a search and if anyone is letting you activate your older 2g/3g non-VOLTE phone go ahead and switch.  But you'll be writing the same letter to them before long. 

I can guarantee you Verizon knows exactly what it will cost them.  Just like they did when the big black things that sat on the table that you stuck your finger in and turned to dial a number were no more.  Technology changes.  Like it or not we need to adapt.

I did a quick search and found plans for as low as $2-$3 per month depending on useage.  That's cheaper than you're paying now.  

[znel52]

It is what it is. Technology advances, time marches on. You expect Verizon to keep 3G around for the 1% of people that have 3G only phones? Get a new flip phone or move to a new carrier. I'm sure Verizon doesn't care the small number of people still holding on to this old technology won't hurt their bottom line.

[CommunityName20]

This reply goes out to "znel52," who wrote, "Get a new flip phone or move to another carrier.  I'm sure Verizon doesn't care..."

I would say you're correct that Verizon doesn't care that it's losing its most loyal customers.  I would also say that you're unaware that the new flip-phones are based on the same software as the current crop of "smart" phones and therefore have all the same vulnerabilities without the same advantages.  It's a clear-cut case of forcing people into using "smart"phone technology whether they want it or not.

This is a gamble that the "23dogs" persona seems to endorse, based on his/her arrogant brush-offs of the many valid concerns that people are raising.  Even "eye-rolls."  How can a person who rolls his/her eyes at legitimate customer concerns even hold a job in customer service?

[mama23dogs]

@CommunityName20

1.   I'm a customer, not a Verizon customer service person.   Unless the language is 'form' with lots of syrup, and clearly identified as support, it's not an employee. 

2.  Changing carriers won't help as all carriers are dealing with the same few manufacturers.  And most carriers are running on infrastructure built by major carriers. 

3.   Current flip phones do have a rudimentary version of Android operating system.  Kaios OS is what most use.  I'm not sure what you think is insecure about using a smartphone. The information on the smartphone is as secure as the operator makes it.   If you use email on a home computer, what makes you think that is any more secure than email on my Android phone? It's not. 

4.   I can assure you that  Warren Buffett no longer carries a flip phone.  He upgraded to an iPhone in February 2020.   You can look it up.  iOS is sandboxed operating system, and very hack proof.  

5.   Most of Verizon's long-term and loyal customers have moved along with the times and are using smartphones. The market for flip phones is extremely small which is why there are so few offered on the website as opposed 2 a couple of dozen different types of smartphones.  Isn't a cell phone carrier allowed to offer what sells?  That's how our American system works.  

96% of Americans own a cellphone, 81% (and dropping) are smartphones.  More than 50% of the American smartphone users own an iPhone.  

6.   Verizon (and other carriers) are shutting down the network your old phone was compatible with. The purpose is to offer better data services.  Unfortunately, it's what most of customers want. 

7.    I'm not sure why you think that software updates and security patches are that big a deal.   Most take 10 minutes to install, at night when you plug in to recharge.  They don't happen that often.   

8.   I have been using a smartphone for 9 years, and haven't butt dialed anyone.  Most return to 'home screen', and you can't butt dial from there.  The screen turns off when not in use. 

9.  Try Great call.  Great call sells the Jitterbug phones and great call runs on Verizon network. I am sure that great call's flip phone is also an Android based operating system.

10.  Many people run their businesses, do their banking, keep in touch with loved ones, all on a 6-inch screen. 40% of Americans have no other internet access other than a smartphone.  

[mama23dogs]

*typo

96% have CellPhones and rising 

81% and riding own smartphones 

40% of Americans only access to the internet is through their smartphone oh, this number is gradually dropping

[Pagraham0823]

This just another way to get more money from loyal customers.  Should be illegal.  We are being forced to purchase other phones and does not seem right.  These phones are way too expensive.