Does Verizon even care about customer loyalty anymore?

[immto]

I can't believe this and I don't think I'm wrong either. Verizon has structured their new plans in such a way we are screwed no matter what we do.  I currently have an older best of Everything Plan with 3 lines.  2 are still on "Edge" plans and 1 is paid in full.  I'm currently getting a $25 discount for each of the "Edge" line which means my line access is $15. The Paid in full line is $40.  The plan is $70.  They want me to change to a "new Plan" and say I'll save $16.66 per month.  Which Is actually more like $10 because 2 of my lines will actually cost more.   But here is where it gets really scary. 

If I were to take the deal I get a $408 phone, for 99.99, (If I choose a new 2 year contract) so I would save $308, but Verizon is going to turn around and charge me an additional $480 (Because the line access fee goes up from $20 to $40 if you don't have a payment plan), so I don't save anything. OR... I take the new Plan which saves me 10-16 per month, They say $16.66 but I think it's closer to $10 but the payment plan means I pay $408 for the phone. so I save $399 but pay $408. And that $399 is actually probably $240.  So either way I pay more.  I've gone around and around on this with at least 3 different Verizon reps and they will not budge, nor will they even admit that I end up paying more no matter how I go. Customer loyalty is worthless I guess. 

[VDPszonek]

To answer your question, no they do not care.  My VzW account was hacked and an iPad mini was ordered and shipped to a state I don't even live in!  The hackers also were able to change my calling plan.  This happened in mid July.  After weekly calls to Verizon lasting at least an hour +, I decided to write a letter and send it to Ronan [Removed] in the Basking Ridge, NJ office.  That was on Oct. 25 - and still no response!

Monday I received a call from a "Chelseaa" whom I've been trying to call back now for 2 days, also to no avail.

After 22 years of being a loyal customer, I'm so done.  Bad or poor customer service does not even begin to describe what I would call it.  I'm so angry, I even cancelled my iPhone 7.

Thank god my contract expires in Jan. 2017 - AT&T, here i come!

personal information removed as required by the Verizon Wireless Terms of Service

Message edited by Verizon Moderator

[nowayout07]

After today's incident speaking and chatting with multiple people over the phone and online to the point of tears since 4 am I am DONE, I am BEYOND DONE and I'm [Removed] They say they care, I say [Removed] They screwed up numerous things with my account and don't take responsibility and I am still waiting for the [Removed] phone call ........They should just tell you right out to [Removed]   instead of wasting my entire [Removed] day waiting by the phone and endless amounts of time between chatting and calling because I'm trying to fix my [Removed]  cell phone so I can use it.. 17 years of loyalty between my husband and myself with their wireless, internet, and residential service. Not to mention the promotional [Removed] of bundle this and that and we will give you a discount. Frauds

[Ann154]

Good luck with the new carrier.

[vzw_customer_support]

We absolutely care you remaining our valued customer, immto. I’d like to be sure we clear everything up regarding your plan and phone options so I’ve sent you a Private Message here in the forum. Please access https://community.verizonwireless.com/inbox to continue.

JenniferH_VZW
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If my response answered your question please click the "Correct Answer" button under my response. This ensures others can benefit from our conversation. Thanks in advance for your help with this!!

[immto]

I did as you request, but you'll be the 4th Rep I've talked with.  I guess we'll see what you have to say. 

[Weth]

Of course if you get a new phone, one way or the other you will pay the full price for that phone.  You do not need to buy a new phone every 2 years.  This is a big reason people pay so much.  Before the cost of the phone was cooked into the rates, but now it is much more evident how much all these new olives every two years costs you. 

If if you just switch plans, you don't need to get a new phone.  As your other lines come off device payments, switching to the Verizon plan makes more and more financial sense for you. 

Even now, being slightly net ahead, you should switch.  Plus you will get overage protection with safety mode and carryover of data for 1 extra month.  Just hold off getting phones until you really need one.  Then buy outright if you can, it on payment plan.  Buying on 2 year contract rarely makes sense with the Verizon plan even though the phone seems cheaper, as you have calculated already. 

[immto]

How long have you been a wireless user?  It used to be common understanding that agreeing to a contract meant you got a benefit.  Anyone who has been using wireless for more then a few years knows that.  The carriers are getting more and more stingy.  First unlimited, didn't mean unlimited anymore, now it does again, sort of...  And why are these phones so expensive?  What is the actual invoice cost, what is the cost?  I have a feeling there is some funny business going on here.  

[Weth]

I have been a cellular user for 26 years.  The cost was always baked into the total cost of service giving one a false sense of getting something when they did not.  It has always been smoke and mirrors. 

Your research is wrong on profit margin for phones.  Apple, which has the best profit margin by far, has 40% margin.  Resellers like Verizon make very little on reselling smartphones. 

Go with what makes most sense to you, that is the beauty of competition.  Verizon will be forced to change if enough people leave. 

My my advice was sound, keep costs lower by not getting a new phone every 2 years.   That advice works on any carrier. 

[immto]

Well I've been a user for about 20 years and I know the price has always been worked into the cost of the service, but the carriers have never been so bold as to charge you more, if you commit to a contract.  Back in the day, you got your free or deeply discounted phone in exchange for a committed term.  If I dropped the cash to buy a phone, the phone belonged to me and I could take the service and leave it whenever I wanted, with no penalty.  Now it's totally different, they want you to pay full price for the phone, AND, they want to charge you MORE, if you dare commit to a contract, and take the little discount they pretend to give you. 

I would like to see where you are getting your 40% profit margin information.  I've seen reports for Bill of Materials from isuppli, which show the costs of phones like the Galaxy S series costing in the low $200's.  And Samsung also makes many of it's parts, so the cost is mostly internal.  Those figures are a little outdated and Samsung has done much in the way of improvement and automation in the last few years, so those costs could actually be even lower today.  Iphones have a much larger portion of the market share, I would find it very hard to believe that an iphone is costing more than $200 to build.    

[Weth]

Bill of materials and final cost is not the true profit margin. You must pay people to put it together, you must pay to ship the phone, you must pay to store the phone in warhouses so you have enough supply on day 1, you must pay to design and test the phone....

Here is one of many examples from reliable sources about the true profit margins around 40%

@Analysts worrying about Apple's future profitability and gross margins - Business Insider

If you pay full price for the phone, you are not charged more. The price you pay on contract is not the full price, but a highly subsidized price that you end up paying back with higher fees.

I don't see where you are going to go to that doesn't do something similar. ATT, the same. Tmobile - no longer does any subsidized contracts, so all phones are full price on payment plan or full out. Good luck to you, but your current understandings are just a bit off.

[immto]

Dude that shows the companies profit, not the margin on a single iphone.  Anyone who understands business, knows that a company as large as Apple, has a lot of moving parts, and most of us have known for a while that Apple in particular has been subsidizing their overall operation with the profits off their single profitable item, the iphone.  That does not mean their profit margin on an iphone is 41%, it means that overall they made 41%, that includes all the other computers they lost money on.

Just because all the other carriers are screwing us over, doesn't make it right.    

[Weth]

Those are specific margins for the iPhone. Overall Apple gross margins are seen here:

Apple Gross Profit Margin (Quarterly) (AAPL)

They are lower than on the iPhones. Profit margins on iPads and computers is less than they get on the iPhone.

I don't understand what you want. Companies are in it for profit, even to maximize profit. You are in it to minimize costs. Either you buy or you don't and the company would need to adjust to the market. There are many other cheaper options out there if that is your only measure.

It is better now since it is no longer hidden in a fee. I have 6 lines and with 32 GB of data and average $33 per line. I am satisfied and feel I am getting a decent deal. Sure I think data is still overpriced, but it is better than it was even a few years ago.

[mama23dogs]

immto wrote:

Well I've been a user for about 20 years and I know the price has always been worked into the cost of the service, but the carriers have never been so bold as to charge you more, if you commit to a contract. Back in the day, you got your free or deeply discounted phone in exchange for a committed term. If I dropped the cash to buy a phone, the phone belonged to me and I could take the service and leave it whenever I wanted, with no penalty. Now it's totally different, they want you to pay full price for the phone, AND, they want to charge you MORE, if you dare commit to a contract, and take the little discount they pretend to give you.

Don't know what plan your on, but that is not the case.  Your plan and service are now separate.  You pay a fair market price for each. 

If you still have and choose a contract option, the price of the phone will be built into your monthly fee.  what you did NOT get back in the day, is a discount on the line fee if you did buy a phone outright.  That was The ripoff, not the current plans.

[immto]

It's arguable if we're really getting a "fair market price" on the phone, but that's not the point I was making.  Back in the day they did not give a line fee discount, you're correct, BUT, the line fee stayed the same, whether you paid for your phone or took the discount.  Now they are giving you a line fee discount if you pay for the phone, or if you take a payment plan, BUT, not, if you take a discount on the phone.  So in other words, they are NOT giving us a benefit for staying a loyal customer. 

[Weth]

I just got 8 GB monthly for free for being a "loyal" customer. By loyal, I assume you mean you pay your bills. Before you were paying for the phone even after it was paid off on the contract. That wasn't fair. Not it is more transparent and fair. When the phone is paid off on the contract, your costs go down. You keep thinking you were actually getting a phone for 99 cents and you never were. It was all smoke and mirrors marketing ploy. Then after 2 years if you did not get a new phone, you still kept paying a higher fee for that line than it otherwise would have been.

There is no reason to do a contract today. Usually the best deal is the payment plan. Times change, things change, adjust. Back in the day I paid $50 a month for 100 minutes, no text messages, no data. Things are better now.

[immto]

No, I was not paying for the phone even after it was paid off, because the fee was paid for up front, and then it was done, the costs, as we already discussed were built into their contract pricing, or cost of doing business.  The overall costs of having a mobile phone have not really come down, in fact they have steadily gone up, so it's not like the carriers are really giving us anything.  I can remember 10 years ago I was paying for 4 lines and my bill never went over $200.  Today I'm paying over $200 for 3 lines.  Yes, it's better service, and yes the phones are better, but also as we discussed, technology is always improving and as such, it should be getting less expensive over time.  Somehow, people like you are under the impression that this progression should not flow down to those of us who pay for the service, our service should always get more expensive and we should always get less in return, according to your philosophy.  I'm starting to wonder if you're not a paid troll who just defends Verizon all day.     

[Weth]

immto wrote:

No, I was not paying for the phone even after it was paid off, because the fee was paid for up front, and then it was done, 

But this is where you are mistaken. The fee was not upfront. Part of it was the upgrade fee, part of it was the cheap phone that didn't actually cover the price of the phone, and the other was a hidden built in charge every month on your bill. Verizon admitted to this to the FCC and that is why they started to split out the extra $20 charge if you are on contract. This is how Verizon could afford to give away phones every 2 years, because you were overpaying every month and you continued to pay for your phone even after 2 years.

This helps explain a bit.

[adr1997]

none of us are paid. this is a community forum where customers come and discuss things. there are no Verizon employees here unless you count moderators and the occasional employee (which will be verified by their name). I wish I got paid to defend Verizon. who doesn't. as far as everyone is concerned I believe we are all consumers not employees. and good luck with whoever you switch to. nothing will change they are all the same

[immto]

OK, sure...

[Ann154]

Out of the 28 replies in this thread, only one was an official VZW rep. They offered to review your phone and plan options by sending you a private Direct Message through the community forum inbox.