Microsoft Lumia 950 and 950XL
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Verizon Explain this one. You are greedy [removed]. What's is your freakin deal with windows phones. Get with the program or I'm switching. I've been with Verizon since year 2000 and I have 4 phones on my account, are you ready to lose my business??? I hope you are happy about trying to monopolize your stupid network. Have a great holiday season.
Verizon may be blocking Microsoft Lumia 950 and 950 XL from operating on its network
Profanity removed as required by the Verizon Wireless Terms of Service
Message edited by Verizon Moderator
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Microsoft did not submit the 550 and the 950s for CDMA certification. The phones were purposely restricted to GSM networks. It wasn't just us VZW customers that cannot use these phones. VZW, Sprint and their respective resellers are all in the same boat.
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We've been asking for years why VZW pushes people away from Windows phones, but VZW doesn't answer us. If another carrier works in your area, vote with your dollars. I just did and not only can we use the devices we want, we got a few additional bonuses too!
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There are alternatives to buying a Windows Phone at a Verizon Wireless Store. A 735 can be purchased at a Microsoft Store for the same pricing that is found at a VZW Store. Likewise VZW sells phones over the Internet for the same pricing as at their brick and mortar stores.
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Except that there has never been a Windows phablet on the VZW network. And we all know VZW's attitude toward Windows devices...
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If a device is made and certified to operate on Verizon Wireless's network, it can be used and VZW cannot stop it even if it was purchased outside of a VZW Store or kiosk.
Because Microsoft limited the three new handsets to GSM networks, sales figures will be lower than had been certified for everything...and Microsoft knows this.
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Wrong!
Microsoft did not limit these devices, Verizon chose to lock out the product identifier so that it's network will not allow these phones to work on its network. The phones ship unlocked and ready to work on all networks, including. Missing, however, is Band 13, which is a set of 700MHz frequencies used by Verizon in some locations. So even if the phones were used on the Verizon system, there may be some spots where they would have trouble with network availability. Why the Band 13 frequencies were left out of these devices but in included in previously manufactured devices is a mystery to me. Still, I am taking my dollars to another carrier that is not so biased against Windows. I happen to love the way that my four Windows 10, multi-platform devices all work in harmony with each other. No matter what I use, it's the same experience. Not even their "Golden Child" Apple can make that claim.
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No sorry you are wrong, Microsoft did limit these devices by not enabling CDMA bands via the firmware. Here are the FCC reports for them, 950 (OET List Exhibits Report) 950 XL (OET List Exhibits Report) neither lists CDMA being enabled.
If CDMA (along with some LTE bands) were enabled out of the box VZW would have to allow the devices on the network. The biggest question on why Microsoft chose not to enable the necessary bands for VZW and Sprint in the first place and sell the devices from their store....
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True, the FCC OET List Exhibits Report does not include the 950, as you stated but there could be reasons for this that have nothing to do with phone capability or ability to pass the Office of Engineering and Technology at the FCC. I do know that the OET list is not always complete, not always up to date and even occasionally has errors. Since these are new devices and only a handful have made it to AT&T, the final OET list will likely match the Microsoft printed specifications, as it usually does. This I know from having worked in the industry for many years. The problem is not technical, but philosophical. It is obvious, as many have already stated, that Verizon is not at all interested in diluting it's stake in Android and Apple by training their people about Windows.
I have a 928 running Windows 10, as a member of the Windows Insider Team. It has worked very well on the Verizon network thus far. I got the original phone from Verizon because I had switched to them because ATT did not cover the area that I was moving to very well. Since then ATT has improved coverage to the point that they now cover more of the area than Verizon.
I do believe that the 950 and 950XL are both interim devices that were rushed to market to keep the slot alive. I won't buy one right now, because I am waiting to see how Microsoft handles their first fully in-house design. If Verizon continues to distance themselves from Windows, It may be that Microsoft will leave out the Verizon only bands completely. The fewer bands they have to include, the better the device will perform; better selectivity, signal rejection, harmonic suppression, etc. It is going to be a bumpy road for a while, but I am Windows for the long haul. That's strictly my personal opinion. I have made up my mind to switch back to ATT with my 928, since I can get support over there, as their sales people have actually seen a Windows phone. I was in a Verizon store a week ago and the salesperson had never even seen one in person.
Thank you for your response to my comment.
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CDMA is 2G, and WCDMA is 3G. Maybe, this is a manufacturing move to force network upgrades.
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J_Icon wrote:
CDMA is 2G, and WCDMA is 3G. Maybe, this is a manufacturing move to force network upgrades.
CDMA = 1XX
WCDMA = UMTS or 3G for GSM
EVDOrev.A/0 = 3G for CDMA.
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Mikhael928 wrote:
Wrong!
Microsoft did not limit these devices, Verizon chose to lock out the product identifier so that it's network will not allow these phones to work on its network. The phones ship unlocked and ready to work on all networks, including. Missing, however, is Band 13, which is a set of 700MHz frequencies used by Verizon in some locations. So even if the phones were used on the Verizon system, there may be some spots where they would have trouble with network availability. Why the Band 13 frequencies were left out of these devices but in included in previously manufactured devices is a mystery to me. Still, I am taking my dollars to another carrier that is not so biased against Windows. I happen to love the way that my four Windows 10, multi-platform devices all work in harmony with each other. No matter what I use, it's the same experience. Not even their "Golden Child" Apple can make that claim.
Actually, MSFT chose not to get the 950/XL approved for the CDMA networks. Of course, everyone is guessing that VZW had something to do with it, but the bottom line is that the 950 only works on GSM networks. This is why I finally left VZW, and so far, I'm much happier!
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The answer is personal preference. What sells well is what is being pushed in stores. Name One multi product company that pushes their worse sellers or often hold a display. Also have to consider the person doing the selling comfort level on a product. Most reps don't know a lick about a lot of products and just push the canned responses they learn from experience. You'll see it all the time especially those who are not eager for their jobs to learn every product they have. I don't buy into the conspiracy theories of Verizon intentionally doing it.
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Tidbits wrote:
I don't buy into the conspiracy theories of Verizon intentionally doing it.
At first I thought it was just me, but after hitting dozens of retail shops all around the country, I started wondering. But then talking to a lot of other people (and seeing thousands of posts by others having the same experience) that have ran across the exact same thing all around the nation, it's just to consistent of a message for it not to be coming from corporate.
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Though my experience is localized, I've been told by sale associates not to buy a Windows Phone...even when I showed them my Icon. The debate is moot. I will get a WP, and maybe I will wait for the "Surface Phone."
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J_Icon wrote:
Though my experience is localized, I've been told by sale associates not to buy a Windows Phone...even when I showed them my Icon. The debate is moot. I will get a WP, and maybe I will wait for the "Surface Phone."
Just saw this about the upcoming "Surface Phone." I'm still saying probably a year out.
The Surface Phone you've always wanted is happening | Windows Central
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If not a full year away, darn close. Originally they were saying May '16 but now it's just "second half 2016." I hope they use the time to get the issues plaguing the 950 sorted out by release time.
Note to Microsoft: the battery has to last a full day on a charge. It's 2015. We expect a little more.
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If there was a conspiracy against Microsoft then Verizon wouldn't be selling the Lumia 735. The lack of a 950 on Verizon is 100% on Microsoft. I don't understand Microsoft some times. They're the 800 lb. gorilla in the room (ANY room), they're fighting for relevance in the mobile phone business (they bought Nokia's D&S division for BILLION$ and enjoy a minuscule market share), and yet they limit a new flagship device by eliminating HALF the potential customers in the U.S. by failing to have CDMA bands supported. In what universe does that make sense??
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The 735 is a low to mid level unit with a price that is easy on the wallet.
I believe that Nokia designed the 735 to be a Verizon Wireless exclusive model.
Despite the fact that Microsoft purposely restricted the 550 and the 950s to GSM networks, VZW still has the reputation for being unfriendly towards Windows devices. The statement issued by VZW where the spokesperson butchered the name of the 950/950XL and compounded things be referring to Microsoft as "Nokia" speaks volumes.
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Regarding the loss of CDMA capabilities: The cellular world is changing and CDMA is going away, just like GSM is going away and IDEN (a GSM variant, think Nextel) went away. Networks are becoming more standardized in all companies, even many companies that provide their own cellular network, like the one that I worked for till I had to go on disability. I believe that many of the decisions made by both the carriers and the manufacturers is as it has always been; "I will like you if you like me unless someone else comes along that suits me better." Verizon HAD to block the 950 and 950XL because of the fact that they are not CDMA phones and they do not include the 700MHz Band 13. Whether or not the Band 13 thing is an oversight, misprint or intentional omission, it will come to light soon enough, without speculation. A certain amount of bandwidth for CDMA and GSM will be retained until the majority of users no longer need it. All the carriers would LOVE to dump CDMA and GSM today, if they could. It would be less infrastructure to care for and would give them more bandwidth for the newer technologies. Evolution always has bumps. This is no different and is a good thing. When channel bandwidth was reduced from 25kHz to 12.5kHz they figured out how to squeeze it down to 6.25kHz and then how to combine it into a giant multi-megahertz wide channel broken up by digital codes and/or time division multiplexing.
My final word on this subject, as I am leaving Verizon in the next few days, is do what seems right for you. I don't like the fact that I have yet to walk into a Verizon store and get Windows support, whereas every AT&T store I have ever been in had at least one Windows Guru. I was with AT&T and changed to Verizon two years ago because AT&T didn't cover my new home. Now they do, so back I go. Good luck to you all and may you make the best decision you can.
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Verizon HAD to block the 950 and 950XL because of the fact that they are not CDMA phones and they do not include the 700MHz Band 13.
This is a catch-22. The hardware in the 950/XL fully supports CDMA. It's uncertain on why Microsoft decided not to pay for the CDMA certification and apply for VZW Open Access Provisions. Rumor was that VZW wanted to charge Microsoft more for OAP than for other devices. Another rumor is that VZW wasn't going to sell the devices and Microsoft decided it was to costly to pay for certifications and sell a few amount of devices in their store.
I'm waiting for the Surface Phone next year
