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Is it true that Verizon as gone evil again and is blocking...

Is Verizon really blocking the use of Google Search and forcing customers to us BING?

Is Verizon really blocking the use of Google Maps and Navigation so at to force users to use their pay for VZ Navigator?

If this it true then Verizon has once again gone back to being evil.

Android was to be an open platform not to be crippled by greedy carriers. Did you not learn that after the Motorola V710? Did you not learn that after the success you've had with the Droid? When will you ever learn to stop screwing your customers?

If this is true then this may be the last year I stay with Verizon after 18 years of service even if you do get the iPhone because who know if you'll try to cripple it as well.

I'm sure no one will read this as I'm sure that Verizon will delete it for violating something in your TOS and violating my free speech in the process.

So Verizon, want to clear this up and prove me wrong? I hope you can because I really thought you were moving away from your evil ways of the past and I was beginning to like you again.

Comments

crimedoggies

Timon0x31 wrote:
Is Verizon really blocking the use of Google Search and forcing customers to us BING?
BING is the default search engine for the Fascinate, but you can bookmark Google search, you just can't put it on your home screen.
Is Verizon really blocking the use of Google Maps and Navigation so at to force users to use their pay for VZ Navigator?
Nope, Google Maps is still available in the marketplace and can be used on the Fascinate.
If this it true then Verizon has once again gone back to being evil.
Not totally
Android was to be an open platform not to be crippled by greedy carriers. Did you not learn that after the Motorola V710? Did you not learn that after the success you've had with the Droid? When will you ever learn to stop screwing your customers?
It still is, the search engine does not prevent you from creating your own apps or personalizing your device.
If this is true then this may be the last year I stay with Verizon after 18 years of service even if you do get the iPhone because who know if you'll try to cripple it as well.

I'm sure no one will read this as I'm sure that Verizon will delete it for violating something in your TOS and violating my free speech in the process.
Not likely, they seem to actually give more flexibility to the folks that complain.
So Verizon, want to clear this up and prove me wrong? I hope you can because I really thought you were moving away from your evil ways of the past and I was beginning to like you again.
Seems you jumped the gun on this one.

crimedoggies

Timon0x31 wrote:
Is Verizon really blocking the use of Google Search and forcing customers to us BING?

Is Verizon really blocking the use of Google Maps and Navigation so at to force users to use their pay for VZ Navigator?

If this it true then Verizon has once again gone back to being evil.

Android was to be an open platform not to be crippled by greedy carriers. Did you not learn that after the Motorola V710? Did you not learn that after the success you've had with the Droid? When will you ever learn to stop screwing your customers?

If this is true then this may be the last year I stay with Verizon after 18 years of service even if you do get the iPhone because who know if you'll try to cripple it as well.
Actually, they wouldn't need to. Apple does all the crippling that device needs!!
I'm sure no one will read this as I'm sure that Verizon will delete it for violating something in your TOS and violating my free speech in the process.

So Verizon, want to clear this up and prove me wrong? I hope you can because I really thought you were moving away from your evil ways of the past and I was beginning to like you again.

Timon0x31

Is Verizon really blocking the use of Google Search and forcing customers to us BING?

BING is the default search engine for the Fascinate, but you can bookmark Google search, you just can't put it on your home screen.

So what, the whole point is that they should NOT dictate what I want to use for my default search provider and I should not have to bring up the web browser to use Google Search. It's my phone now not theirs.

Worse yet, I'm now reading that Verizon plans to do this on all of the Android phones, even ones that people have had for months, via an update just like they did on the BB Storm. Hell if they do this to my Droid it's going to be law suite time because there is nothing in my contract that says they can remove my default search provider and put one that they want. It would be nice to find a judge that would tell Verizon to stop and restore all the phones back.

Android was to be an open platform not to be crippled by greedy carriers.

It still is, the search engine does not prevent you from creating your own apps or personalizing your device.

As soon as a carrier starts removing "STANDARD" Android features from the phone and putting on ones which have nothing to do with the operation of the wireless network and that you can't remove or override they have started crippling the phone.

My last phone was a Motorola V710 which Verizon lost a law suite over. If they go down this route again I expect they will loose another one. The only reason I did not move off of Verizon was the coverage. I didn't buy a new phone because of the way they acted until they came out with the Droid and I found that it was pure uncrippled Android. They go down this road and that reason goes out the window.

FYI, the only reason I posted this here is because the Fascinate is the first Verizon Android to see this happen to.

I don't like congress to make a bunch of new laws but it high time for them to dictate to carriers that they CAN NOT TOUCH ANY FEATURE ON A PHONE THAT"S NOT USED TO CONTROL THE NETWORK. That means you can play with the baseband but not the smartphone features.

Medic960

I was going to buy the fascinate. I will never buy an Android phone that will only let me use Bing as the default search engine. It is garbage. And my contract is up in December. Keep it up and I'll go to AT&T for the I-Phone. Hope all others do the same.

Tidbits

Big deal... Sorry, but there are worse things not being able to pick a default search tool. Not everyone wants to use Google search, and now this gives them an option other than Google for once.

You can always download Google search from the market and NOT use the one preinstalled... Just like everyone else :smileyhappy:

ibanez737

Timon0x31 wrote:
Is Verizon really blocking the use of Google Search and forcing customers to us BING?
BING is the default search engine for the Fascinate, but you can bookmark Google search, you just can't put it on your home screen.

So what, the whole point is that they should NOT dictate what I want to use for my default search provider and I should not have to bring up the web browser to use Google Search. It's my phone now not theirs.

Worse yet, I'm now reading that Verizon plans to do this on all of the Android phones, even ones that people have had for months, via an update just like they did on the BB Storm. Hell if they do this to my Droid it's going to be law suite time because there is nothing in my contract that says they can remove my default search provider and put one that they want. It would be nice to find a judge that would tell Verizon to stop and restore all the phones back.

Android was to be an open platform not to be crippled by greedy carriers.
It still is, the search engine does not prevent you from creating your own apps or personalizing your device.

As soon as a carrier starts removing "STANDARD" Android features from the phone and putting on ones which have nothing to do with the operation of the wireless network and that you can't remove or override they have started crippling the phone.

My last phone was a Motorola V710 which Verizon lost a law suite over. If they go down this route again I expect they will loose another one. The only reason I did not move off of Verizon was the coverage. I didn't buy a new phone because of the way they acted until they came out with the Droid and I found that it was pure uncrippled Android. They go down this road and that reason goes out the window.

FYI, the only reason I posted this here is because the Fascinate is the first Verizon Android to see this happen to.

I don't like congress to make a bunch of new laws but it high time for them to dictate to carriers that they CAN NOT TOUCH ANY FEATURE ON A PHONE THAT"S NOT USED TO CONTROL THE NETWORK. That means you can play with the baseband but not the smartphone features.

While I don't agree with the Bing stuff and it's probably leaning me away from the Fascinate, good luck with the law suit. Here's the verbage straight from your contract:

My Wireless Device

Your wireless device must comply with Federal Communications Commission regulations, be certified for use on our network, and be compatible with your Service. Please be aware that we may change your wireless device's software, applications or programming remotely, without notice. This could affect your stored data, or how you've programmed or use your wireless device. You don't own the software in any SIM (Subscriber Identity Module) card that you may use with your Service. The SIM card software is licensed to you for use with the Service only, and we may change it remotely and without notice. If you bought a wireless device for Postpay Service from Verizon Wireless that doesn't use a SIM card, and you want to reprogram it for use with another wireless network, the default programming code is set to "000000" or "123456." But please note that your wireless device may not work with another wireless network, or the other wireless carrier may not accept your wireless device on its network. If you activate a wireless device for Prepaid Service, it can be used for Prepaid Service only during the first six months after activation and cannot be reprogrammed for use with any other carrier's wireless service even if it's no longer used to receive our Service.

Tidbits

Verbage doesn't matter. You can use the Google search tool even if the default belongs to Bing. So right there the Lawsuit will fail because you have choices and it doesn't force you to use it.

Ann154

I hope the ability to install third party applications is still in this phone. If one ever needs factory reset their phone, this option can be used to restore the applications that were on the phone.

AZSALUKI

am i missing something? why couldn't you just download the google search widget from the market????? after the 2.2 update i had to do that anyhow.

Tidbits

I already said that. lol

I think it's just someone trying to rant, or wanting attention. Why would this device be different than any other Android on Verizon other than the search widget? All this hoopla for a Search widget which is easily downloadable from the Market.

PiperCrab

So let me get this straight: they shouldn't dictate what default search engine you use only because they used Bing and not Google? Are you even listening to your own **bleep** rants?

I for one love using Bing; whatever I need to find Bing brings it up immediately and it works very well. Now you are trying to tell Verizon that they should only use Google and not any other search provider they see fit. Way to be one sided mate; this planet doesn't revolve around you and your silly little complaints. Are you even a dude?

The best thing I've seen when it comes to selecting search providers is to do what Apple did with the iTouch: add all three providers (Yahoo, Bing, Google) and let peeps select which one they want as the search provider. That way we won't have any prepubescent girls whining about sillyness.

Btw, I am so glad you don't own a Droid X; I probably toss mine out the window just because you had one.

papa_leo

No, you can't download GOOGLE SEARCH widget. It is hidden on Fascinate. I check that today and if you search Marketplace for that widget from DX and DI, you can see it and download it. On Fascinate, it's simply doesn't exist on the Marketplace. VZW blocked it.

It is all about money. VZW needs to satisfy their shareholders and it sounds like MS overbid Google for payment to VZW for it to enforce Fascinate on what default search engine and map should be installed. Now it all makes sense why it took so long for VZW to release this phone, they were doing testing on how to successfully block Google from that phone.

I wanted Fascinate so bad that I even returned DX (because of the reboot issues) but now I am looking back again at DX (hopefully with 2.2 correction for reboot).

Timon0x31

I love it when someone resorts to personal attacks.

Android is a Google phone and as such I expect that it will have all the standard Google applications. I can accept, even though I don't like it, restrictions on tethering but not making changes to the general operation of the device or blocking apps that they don't like.

I can support them if they want to add the Bing Search app and allow you to choose to make it your default but I can't support them FORCING customers to only use Bing by blocking the Google Search app. MSF stated: "Well I just did a search using my Droid X and got zero returns. Has verizon blocked it for all?" I did a search on my Droid and I can still find it so at least it's not blocked for ALL Verizon Android phones YET.

Droid users currently have the option to use Verizon VZ Navigator which is the right way to go but it's EVIL if they decide to block the use of the free apps such as Google Search and Googles navigation to force you their paid apps or just to make money from another search engine provider.

If they also removed the ability to download apps from "Unknown sources" option then that's yet another proof it's the dark side for Verizon and total disregard for their customers.

And to those that think I'm just trying to cause trouble, think again. I've supported Verizon for 18 years and in general still do but when a carrier start playing these kind of games they need to be taken to task and it's time for congress to take action to stop carriers from doing things like this. Choice is the right of all and should not be taken away by greedy carrier's.

yellowboy74

Just got mine this morning. This phone is a beast. Can't keep my eyes and hands off of it. FYI, You can download Google Maps from the Market. The first thing i did was trash bing maps and Verizon Navigator. And its pre-loaded with Google Voice Search which is almost the same as the google search widget that is unavailable on this phone. Sorry but you are not going to find it(Google Search Widget) in the Market but there are ways around it. And yes it does have 512MB of ram but it doesn't show it all. Some of the ram is dedicated to video. I compared it to the Vibrant and they register the same number of Ram. But Please don't let google search stop you from buying this phone because like i said , you can download google maps with no problem and works flawless and it has google voice search which in my opinion is almost the same as google search.

djtonic

Google Search isnt blocked from the market on the fascinate specifically. Search on any Android Phone w/ 2.1 or previous and you won't find it.

Once Fascinate gets the upgrade you can download the searh widget.

Still....google can't be too thrilled about it :smileyhappy: But, if that's what it took for Samsung to get the phone out to Verizon's massive network then so be it. Annoying as hell that we can't just un-install this crap they preload

Dj.

dabubbakin

Does anyone know if the new Windows 7 phones will come preloaded with Google search?

dcullen63

I'm new to Android phones - how do you trash apps?! "The first thing i did was trash bing maps and Verizon Navigator." While we're at it WHERE at all the files? I put some books and music on the thing and now don't see them!

Thanks!

Ann154

@dcullen63
If there is a file explorer on your phone, you can find the files that way. Otherwise you have to open the respective application for file, i.e. Music play for music, ereader app for the books.

Back to the phone at hand (Fascinate), did anyone else notice this phone comes preloaded with amazon kindle? I don't have anything against amazon, but I want the choice of which ereader I use on my phone or otherwise.

dcullen63

Ann154 - thanks! now I have this thing figured out, gotta say my old BB Storm just doesn't compare!! I would have liked to have the new Torch or even the iPhone but hey, Samsung seems to want to offer their devices through the carriers we want to use, so why not support them?! After playing with the Fascinate for a few hours I'm not disappointed!!

Ann154

You're welcome.

pool_shark

Found this on another website.

Google Search comming to Facinate (2.2 Update only) Bing will still be the default.

Verizon Wireless has confirmed to Phone Scoop via email that the Samsung Fascinate, which shipped with Bing as the default search engine, will be able to download the official Android Google Search application once the Fascinate is updated to Android 2.2. Verizon Wireless would not confirm when that update is scheduled to take place, but suggested that users who want to use Google Search instead of Bing set Google.com as their Android browser home page. Verizon Wireless spokesperson Brenda Raney said, "You can go to Google's home page and download an icon from that page and use Google as an alternative search option." Alternately, Raney said that Fascinate users can "download Voice Search from the Marketplace and when you use Voice Search, it searches in Google." Though the Android 2.2 update will allow Fascinate users to download, install, and use Google Search, Google Search will not replace Bing as the main search engine that launches when the "Search" button is pressed. That button will always launch Bing, even after Google Search is installed.
from Verizon Wireless

Inchoate

The Fascinate itself is a great device, but Verizon made some very bad decisions on the default setup.

I expected a phone full of subsidized crapware like you get on most new computer desktops, but not being able to remove that crapware was shocking! I don't really care if you put crapware on there, but as the consumer, I want full control over my device. If I cannot remove the crapware, I return the device.

I was so livid that I couldn't delete the **bleep** Blockbuster and Bing apps, that I spent half the day learning about the Android OS, rooting my phone, etc. It's a non-issue now. :-)

I had been contemplating the iPhone 4 vs the Android-based phones for a while. The devices are great, but they're tethered to companies that won't even allow us to customize our own $600 devices! Verizon needs to learn from Google, the company that made the operating system for the very devices they're selling: don't be evil.

Customer loyalty comes from giving us, the consumers, the freedom to make our own decisions, not by forcing us into your preconfigured world of limited choices because of your behind-the-scenes business deals.

AZSALUKI

has anyone tried searching appbrain or another app marketplace? to see if "google search" comes up? i'm just curious. it comes up on my device in the market and appbrain (htc inc), but i am just wondering if "google search" (the actual widget and not the "voice search" app) would maybe show up in appbrain if it's not showing up in the marhet???

KatieC

Got my samsung Fascinate 5 days ago and I love it!!!!! Just upgraded from a Storm 1 and it is a big difference!!!!

Yes.... I dont like bing.... and I dont like the verizon apps but google maps works good and google navigation even better!!!!

My only concern right now is..... how to uninstall the preinstalled apps????

thanks!!!!

Timon0x31

Let me see if I can word this without angering the Verizon Moderator God like I did last time.

pool_shark wrote:
Found this on another website.

Google Search comming to Facinate (2.2 Update only) Bing will still be the default.

Verizon Wireless has confirmed to Phone Scoop via email that the Samsung Fascinate, which shipped with Bing as the default search engine, will be able to download the official Android Google Search application once the Fascinate is updated to Android 2.2. Verizon Wireless would not confirm when that update is scheduled to take place, but suggested that users who want to use Google Search instead of Bing set Google.com as their Android browser home page. Verizon Wireless spokesperson Brenda Raney said, "You can go to Google's home page and download an icon from that page and use Google as an alternative search option." Alternately, Raney said that Fascinate users can "download Voice Search from the Marketplace and when you use Voice Search, it searches in Google." Though the Android 2.2 update will allow Fascinate users to download, install, and use Google Search, Google Search will not replace Bing as the main search engine that launches when the "Search" button is pressed. That button will always launch Bing, even after Google Search is installed.
from Verizon Wireless

You can, without doing anything that violates your Verizon contract, return the Google Search Widget Application to your Facinate running Android 2.1. You won't be able to change the search button but you will at least have the app which is easier to use that bringing up the browser.

Try the following search text in Google.

"restoring google search to the Fascinate"

For fun try the same search in Bing, the difference in the results is most amusing.

Maybe by the time that 2.2 comes out Verizon will see the error of their ways but I doubt it.

Oh, for the mod, I have a copy of this post. If deleted I will take this to Verizon corporate and will post to the press. There is NOTHING in this post that you can say is in violation of your TOS. You may not like it but deleting it would not be a good idea.

CR6

I love reading in so many forums online how people are refusing to buy the Fascinate for the sole reason of Bing being the default search engine. Grow{word filter avoidance}
up people! One of the many reasons people buy an Android phone is {edit for TOS violation}

If you don't like Bing, then bookmark Google and search that way. (I know....that's SO difficult to do!) {edit for TOS violation}

Just stop freakin whining about Bing already. I can promise you that you won't find a single "perfect" smartphone on the market today, nor will you ever. Buy what suits your needs and be happy with it. The whole reason android phones are so popular is {edit for TOS violation}

snrsuave

I am getting tired of people just saying to bookmark Google in the browser. Google search is integrated into the OS. It not only searches the web, it also searches your contacts, music, apps, etc. And Google Maps navigation does not work correctly. Use the navigation and try to hear the directions in a car. The volume is barely audible. I wouldn't be surprised if that was Verizon's doing as well to try and force VZ navigator. Verizon not only removed a search widget, they also removed some of the core functionality of the Android operating system. I really enjoy this phone, so if other's are having different experiences, let me know. There may be an issue with my phone, but I doubt it. The volume for other apps is fine.

Kamar234

Actually that is the problem. They have removed the ability to go into the market and replace Bing on your phone. It would be a minor nuisance if that was all you had to do. They have completely blocked the ability to use a superior native android function for a third party solution for Verizon's and Bing's benefit and to the detriment of their users. Have you used Bing search? it is not bad, but nowhere as good as google's search. And once we upgrade to 2.2, there is no comparison to the new Google voice search and any other voice control system on the market. It is extremely integrated with android. It actually bothers me a lot because I used voice search on my droid running 2.2 while driving and never had to do anything but long press the search button and talk. Now if I were on the road and needed to do something, it would be a multi press function, changing the way I use the phone. This is the heart of crippling. Anything that keeps you from doing something that you would be able to do otherwise is indeed crippling.

Chris3D2

CR6 said: Just stop freakin whining about Bing already.

It's not just about Bing. It's that, on the Verizon and **only** the Verizon version of this phone, the launcher was specifically programmed to disallow Google's search widget from being able to be added to the home screen. If t's pre-configured with Bing, fine, but don't specifically program it to block Google.

It's that for a user to fully reconfigure the phone to use Google, he/she must download and install a 3rd party launcher and a 3rd party browser, some of which cost $$. And then to replace functionality lost (all of Samsung's widgets), the user must again, download and install 3rd party apps, again, some of which cost $$.

And then there's the issue of the phone's limited storage space being used up by all these 3rd party replacements, and the inability to remove the Bing-tied components to reclaim that space.

Then there's the issue of all the other bloat/nag/crap-ware that Verizon that, again, the user is, likewise, unable to remove.

And finally, there's the issue of the *MANY* bugs in this phone - a poorly functioning GPS, weak reception, a buzzy earpiece, barely audible speaker volume - all things which Verizon *SHOULD* have been spending their time and resources addressing, not hard-coding the phone to block Google at every turn.

In other words, Verizon's priorities were totally backwards - satisfy Microsoft desire to be forced down Verizon's customer's throats instead of making sure the phone opperated smoothly for it's customers.

The hardware of the phone is great, and I hate to see it go, but my phone is boxed up and ready to be returned. If I read reports of all the bugs being fixed with 2.2, and it truly being able to be de-Binged, I'll consider buying it again. But there's a lot of other options out there, and there's several other carriers.

I couldn't wait for my 2 year AT&T contract to be up so I could ditch my locked down iPhone for an Android on Verizon. To say this has been a hugely disappointing experience would be an understatement.

AZSALUKI

to everyone......just get launcher pro. with a third party launcher, you can access and use the google search apps/widgets.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C_vObNgV9W8

i know this guy gets into something that most of you WILL NOT want to do. but his other method only requires using a third party launcher to enable access to google widgets. if you search this on youtube, you will find many good videos that can help you out.

Android10

Verizon Wireless is committed to offering customers the best service and feature options on the competitive market. Google and Bing are both great search engines and we are confident that both will provide a great experience to our customers. Google search is not blocked, and Bing is being introduced as another option to better the wireless experience.

Google Maps and VZ Navigator both function great, but some of our customers want the option to use VZ Navigator as that is what they are most familiar with. So we want to provide them with that option. Google maps and navigation services is not blocked.

Verizon Wireless cares for its customers and there overall wireless experience. We want to provide the best, safest, most reliable, and economical services and options to our customers. We also have a responsibility as a company to make sure that we adhere to a strict legal code of ethics as a leading wireless provider.

The products and services we offer are tested and developed to provide the best quality within our network. We in no way wish to infringe upon the freedoms of private developers or customers. We do however have a responsibility to the customer who pay for our service to protect them from harmful software, and provide them with the most compatible options for the network.

We value your impute and are happy that you are satisfied with the Android options we provide. We hope that we can continue to provide you with the most reliable nationwide coverage.

Ann154

Then let us choose to download the navigation, search, music purchase or ereader app of our choice! The phone I had before my droid was a get it now phone. It didn't have any games, navigation or programs preloaded. I had to pick and choose which ones I wanted, pay for, and download to the phone. I mean what is that special tab for in the market labeled Verizon doing but promoting your preferred applications. You talk about caution downloading third party apps, but Bing, Amazon MP3, Blockbuster, Kindle, VZ Navigator, You-Tube and even the Google suite of apps can be thought of as third party applications.

PJNC284

I think more people have an issue with Verizon locking the phone down to bing and VZ Nav. In stock form:

- You CAN'T add the Google Search widget so you're locked to the Bing widget unless you use ADW or Launcher Pro. *Should be fixed whenever Froyo is released

- You CAN'T change the default action for the search soft key to use Google instead of Bing for text and voice searches.

- You CAN'T change the Navigation shortcut in Car Mode to use Google Nav instead of VZ Navigator.

It doesn't really bother me as I never used the widget or search key but Verizon is obviously inconveniencing quite a few potential customers in order to pad their own pockets. Granted it's well known that Verizon's business and marketing practices are questionable at best so it's not much of a surprise.

AZSALUKI

android10....if google search is not blocked then maybe you can explain to everyone how to find it and install it from the market??? and i'm note talking about voice search. i'm talking about the full "google search" widget. everything i've read and seen leads me to believe it IS blocked. if i'm wrong, just tell us how to get it (without using alternative launchers).

Chris3D2

I'd like to thank Noah for the time he has taken to respond to these issues. At the same time, however, I would also like to point out (as constructively as possible :smileywink: ) the dichotomy between what he claims is the motivation behind Verizon's decisions, and the realities of how those decisions effect Verizon's customers.

Verizon Wireless is committed to offering customers the best service and feature options on the competitive market.

Verizon may well offer the best service of any carrier, and I'm willing to accept that my lackluster signal strength may be an isolated issue. And Verizon does offer an impressive range of devices and services. But as it pertains to smart phones, these devices are unarguably hand-held computers with vast, wide ranging capabilities. As such, it's impossible to compile a "best" list of options - the "best" options are the ones that fit each user's particular needs, style and preferences. The "best" option would simply be to afford the user their preferred option. As we all know, this isn't the case here, as many aspects of the phone are pre-configured to specifically disallow efficient access to what is unarguably one of the world's most popular and widely used search engines.

Google search is not blocked, and Bing is being introduced as another option to better the wireless experience.

With all due respect, this is disingenuous. The Google search widget is indeed blocked from being able to be added to the home screen. Even when the Google widget is side-loaded onto the device, it's excluded from the list of widgets that are able to be added to the TouchWiz home screens. And this is specific to the Verizon version of the Galaxy S phone - what is essentially the same phone/OS running on ANY other carrier is capable of adding the Google widget to the home screen. In other words, the operating system of this phone, as customized by Verizon was specifically programmed to disallow the Google search widget on the home screen. And Bind is not being introduced as another option, as you claim, it has been specifically hard-coded as the only option.

Sure, a user can open a browser and navigate to the Google home page and nothing is blocked, but that can entail 3 to 4 steps (opening the browser, bringing up a menu to open a new window, loading a bookmark to Google and finally searching) when a widget on the home screen can accomplish the same thing in 1 step.

I, and many others, do not prefer the Bing search engine, so the pre-installed Bing search widget is not the "best' option for us. Blocking the Google search widget from the home screen significantly impedes our ability to efficiently use our search engine of choice - again, anything but the "best" option for us. Likewise, with the dedicated search button hard-coded directly to the Bing search engine when in the browser, customers who prefer to use Google loose what is an efficient time-saving feature of the phone.

To circumvent the restrictions Verizon has programmed into this phone, a user needs to fully replace both the home screen launcher as well as the entire web browser. Only then can the Google widget be added to the home screen and the dedicated search button linked to the Google search engine when in the Browser. However, in the process, the user looses access to any of the Samsung widgets (which can not be added to 3rd party home screens) and must turn to the Android market for apps to replace that lost functionality. Searching for, downloading and sometimes having to purchase such replacements costs the user time, effort and money - clearly anything but the "best" option.

Verizon Wireless cares for its customers and there overall wireless experience. We want to provide the best, safest, most reliable, and economical services and options to our customers

This statement stands totally at odds with the steps outlined above which are required to configure this phone to fully utilize the Google search engine. I'll go over each one to highlight the fallacy:

We want to provide the best - It should be abundantly clear that when it comes to such integral activities as searching, and being the case with virtually all other Android phones on the market, the "best" option is for the user to have his/her own "option". Verizon doesn't allow that.

safest - By forcing the user to turn to an open software market to replace major components of the operating system in order to have the simple option to fully utilize what is unarguably one of the world's best, most popular and widely used search engines exposes that user to many dangers. At best, these 3rd party replacements might not be fully tested with the overall specific configuration of this phone and at worst could easily contain malicious code, exposing the user to all manner of threat.

most reliable - When it comes to software, reliability is a direct result of testing. It is, therefore, absurd to claim that the restrictions Verizon has programmed into this phone are in the interest of reliability, as they directly causes a user to download untested and unverified software from a market with little overall control and/or oversight.

and economical services - With many of the apps a user would need to replace functionality lost by circumventing Verizon's programmed restrictions costing money (not all Android apps are free), this argument also fails closer inspection.

and options - With the phone specifically hard coded to exclude the Google search widget and linking of the dedicated search button to the Google search engine when in the browser, it's simply disingenuous to claim that the user is being provided the "best" options. In this case, the user is provided no option.

We in no way wish to infringe upon the freedoms of private developers or customers.

By specifically hard-coding a restriction into the stock user interface of the operating system to disallow core functionality that is included in that very operating system in favor of a 3rd party who, honestly, has nothing to do with either the hardware or software of the phone, the freedom of Verizon customers and developers is absolutely being infringed upon.

When each of us bought this phone, we purchased the well known functionality provided by the Android operating system. Verizon's programmed restrictions blocks our access to core functionality that's available to virtually all other android devices, (many of which Verizon itself sells), and we are not afforded the option of enabling that functionality. That is, most certainly, infringing on the freedoms of customers.

We do however have a responsibility to the customer who pay for our service to protect them from harmful software

As stated earlier, by restricting core Android functionality Verizon has forced it's users to replace major system components with 3rd party applications which may be untested, untried and potentially malicious. As such, if Verizon truly believes it has a responsibility to protect it's customers from such dangers, it's failing miserably.

We value your imput

I appreciate that and eagerly await a continued discussion of the issues I've raised here.

xxAndrewNxx

Chris3D2 FTW.

Noah's (Android10's) entire post is offensive -- it's nothing but a propaganda piece.

The VZ Navigator, SocialBeat, NFL Live, Skype, Bing, VCast and other software that was forced onto my BlackBerry Storm is a main reason why I'm upgrading my phone (my and my wife's Samsung Fascinates are in the mail, set to be delivered tomorrow).

I am extremely concerned that all of the pre-loaded garbage is going to smother our Fascinates, just like the unwanted software dragged my Storm into the depths of uselessness.

I'm currently considering refusing my delivery and waiting out my contract, or at least waiting for an offering of a better, smarter smartphone.

I've been a Verizon Customer since 1998 or 1999, save a few years where I experimented with AT&T in college. I'm almost as disappointed now as I was with them.

I don't give two shakes of my fist about Bing ... but at least give me the choice of how to set my own soft keys.

Don't cripple the functions of google maps/navigation because I want to use it in a car cradle and not the expensive and inferior VZ Navigator.

Don't cripple the phone by having senseless launchers on it that eat memory (hiding them isn't an option ... out of site, out of mind is for imbeciles).

I'm not going to "root" my phone because I follow the rules, and I don't want to interfere with the integrity of the phone, service or the software -- but Verizon is putting a stranglehold on my device and are making irreversible decisions for the customers who made it the best cellular service. They are not making the "best" decision for me.

BTW: Noah, did you mean to spell "input," or was "impute" a Freudian slip?

Chris3D3

This is now the 3rd time I've had to register for this forum, because previous registrations mysteriously become locked. I wonder why that is? I fully intend to bring this issue to the attention of Verizon management.

And BTW, I'm still awating a responce from Noah. Nothing in my post was offensive in any way, and I brought up clear issues with many of the statements made in his post.

AZSALUKI

chris3....you have to understand that the vzn employees that come to the forum do so only once in a while. you'll notice throughtout these threads that you only see the same ones a few times...then they disappear. also, most of their input is generic and often times appear to be from a manual. sometimes it appears that the actual question was not read (ie: a member asked about a ringback tone once and a vzn member posted specific instructions on how to download a ringtone).

xxAndrewNxx...if you want FULL google capability then i would refuse that delivery. the htc inc, droidX and droid II do not have bing. i would go with one of those. as far as the preinstalled junk goes.....you just won't find a smartphone these days without it. you can switch phones or even cariers....but unless you go back to a dumb phone, you're going to be stuck with preinstalled apps. they don't bother me (i guess i'm an imbecile? but they truly are out of sight and out of mind and have NO affect on the performance of my incredible...they are simply a few more icons in my app drawer, along with dozens of other apps). i'd like to uninstall them, but they really don't bother me. my issue is bing. don't like, don't want it, and will not get the fascinate now (at least until it gets 2.2 and i see if it truly can become google powered). i'm a phone geek and like to check out new devices, but i love the incredible and i guess i'll stick with it. the fascinate is a great device and i was lookin forward to checkin one out.....but google is what i love about droids. i guess i'll just have to wait for swype to be available to all.

jangmeibit

There seem to be ways to avoid the problems everyone is complaining about... The problem is that you have to go through some bother in order to fix them... I have saved Google as my home screen for the browser, downloaded Google maps, and adjusted my settings to allow the navigation to work. The only thing I can't seem to change is that when I hit the "search" button (the magnifying glass symbol in the lower right), it always goes to bing.

I don't understand why Verizon sells its Motorola Droid phones without these problems. (At least my boyfriend's first generation Droid doesn't).

All that said, I love my phone. It's thin, gorgeous... And after a good bit of tinkering, I have gotten it to do everything I wanted.

Deonisme

so you mad cause you cant access google? go to the browser...need google maps? download it from the market...your complaing over spill milk... and if you wanna leave, good, leave, maybe you'll be happy somewhere else, you get what you pay for, if you want a sorry network, please go...you guys generally come back. Verizon rules all, and i couldnt be happier, my phone works, all the time, never had a problem, but i also know what im doing..{please keep your posts courteous}..people just love to complain

dcdgoth

Is Verizon really blocking the use of Google Search and forcing customers to us BING?

BING is the default search engine for the Fascinate, but you can bookmark Google search, you just can't put it on your home screen.

-> It implies to people who know how to use bookmark. I say half of consumers don't know how to do it.

Is Verizon really blocking the use of Google Maps and Navigation so at to force users to use their pay for VZ Navigator?

Nope, Google Maps is still available in the marketplace and can be used on the Fascinate.

-> Location set-up needs to be remapped. I don't think many people are knowledgeable enough to figure out how to do it. People just want the darn Google stuffs on Google phone.

If this is true then Verizon has once again gone back to being evil.

Not totally

-> I think so. Verizon received $500 million for Bing Search exclusively. MS and VW made 5 year mobile-search deal. We'll be seeing more Bing search engines in future smartphones.

It still is, the search engine does not prevent you from creating your own apps or personalizing your device.

-> Exactly. I have no further comment on this one.

So Verizon, want to clear this up and prove me wrong? I hope you can because I really thought you were moving away from your evil ways of the past and I was beginning to like you again.

Seems you jumped the gun on this one.

-> That's how majority feels about Bing Search.

Azartrus

It's time for my upgrade from my D1 and I don't know what to do about this phone. Everything seems fine and well till you get to the Bing search (who's grand idea was that anyway?) I loved the droid 1 so much because it was an open ended phone. I use google maps and the google navigation extinsively and am saddened by the fact that this phone doesn't seem to work well in the GPS department. The phone's specs on paper look amazing and most of them are but a phone that can't utilize gps functionality very well and that doesn't utilize google search just isint for me

I tried this phone for 2 weeks and did my best to love it, but I need my gps and google search. I have a sad feeling that this phone is going to suffer the same fate as the Samsung Omnia 1 in that it is promised gps fixes etc and never recieves one. Buyer beware Samsung is not know for backing up their phones and you may be waiting for quite a while for you fixes that may never come. I'm not trying to diss anyone's favorite company or their phone.. I'm just going by personal experience from the omnia

toodles..

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