Child Item

Site Totals

61432 Questions Answered 270 Categories

A Virgin Kick in the Teeth

Enjoying your newly broken Motorola DX on the 6-month gestated Blur GB? You're not? And I bet you're enjoying it less considering how much you've plunked down for your phone, how much more you're paying in data charges, and how long you're locked into your contract under a crushing buy-out.

Now kindly examine the information exhibited at this link:

http://bit.ly/kstcnA

Yes, Motorola is now manufacturing a phone for near future release on Virgin Mobile. It ships with stock Android 2.2.

Yes. Motorola with Stock Android. Did I mention MOTOROLA.

It has no Blur. No skin. Nada. It sports a nearly undadulterated copy of the Android OS (2.2, alas) in a device very near in capability to the Droid X. Minimal bloatware (unless you consider a plan checking app bloatware). No crappy rental app from a bankrupt has-been video service. No adware masquerading as pro-football game. No pocket-robbing caller ID bloat. No bloatware of any appreciable kind. No per-month charge nav service. Nothing you'd feel soils your device so badly you'd want to root it and void your warranty. Data plans at this particular carrier are much more competitive than what Big Red yanks out of our wallets. And there are no annual contracts.

Which leads me to ask one very simple question.

WHY THE HELL DOES VIRGIN MOBILE GET STOCK ANDROID ON A MOTOROLA DEVICE AND NOT VERIZON?

We all know it's money. But customers have control over money, too. Just something to think about, very carefully, MotoRizon. You've locked me into another year to decide, and this should make you very afraid.

Mike

Comments

bearone21

same package you signed up for with data but vm is on a system that's pretty thin if you don't live in a pretty big metropolitan area for VOICE ONLY.

http://www.virginmobileusa.com/check-cell-phone-coverage

gerio

Oh, yeah...Tell me you didn't see this COMING.....

MrMRM513 wrote:
Enjoying your new Motorola DX2 (There, fixed that for ya) on the 6-month To what are you referring, the X has been out longer than that gestated Blur GB? (I bought a phone, I didn't have a baby, {please keep your posts courteous}) You're not? I'm detecting a memory problem, I've been enjoying Xs since last July And I bet you're enjoying it less (Geez, well, keep trying, {please keep your posts courteous}) considering how much you've plunked down for your phone, how much more (More than what?) you're paying in data charges, (In the 90s, voice-only calling cost more than what I pay for EVERYTHING I'm getting now. You ain't that old, are ye, {please keep your posts courteous}?and how long you're locked into your contract under a crushing buy-out. {please keep your posts courteous}

Now kindly examine the information exhibited at this link: "Kindly" is an interesting adverb considering the tone of this post...

http://bit.ly/kstcnA

Yes, Motorola is now manufacturing a phone for near future release on Virgin Mobile. It ships with stock Android 2.2. You mean that you are writing all of this and NOT screaming and crying and rolling around on the floor because it's not Gingerbread? Man, a fanboy's life just isn't what it's cracked up to be anymore

Yes. Motorola with Stock Android. Did I mention MOTOROLA. Yea, you did, there's that memory problem again....

It has no Blur. No skin. Nada. It sports a nearly undadulterated (Define "nearly") copy of the Android OS (2.2, alas) (Ahh, I KNEW IT!!) in a device very near in capability to the Droid X. Minimal bloatware (unless you consider a plan checking app bloatware). No crappy rental app from a bankrupt has-been video service. (Don't open it, don't see it) No adware masquerading as pro-football game. (Don't open it, don't see it) No pocket-robbing caller ID bloat. (Okay, gotta admit, don't know what you are talking about. So tell me. Go ahead, you know you wanna...) No bloatware of any appreciable kind. No per-month charge nav service. Funny, I haven't gotten a bill from Google Maps, am I in for a rude awakening? Nothing you'd feel soils your device so badly you'd want to root it and void your warranty. (I use my phone for phone calls, email, mobile web, and sometimes, GPS. I don't pee on it. Does rooting help THAT problem, too?) Data plans at this particular carrier are much more competitive than what Big Red yanks out of our wallets. (Is that what that is? Gee, I thought that was women grabbing my butt all this this time. Guess I was mistaken, ehh?) And there are no annual contracts.

Which leads me to ask one very simple question.

WHY THE HELL DOES VIRGIN MOBILE GET STOCK ANDROID ON A MOTOROLA DEVICE AND NOT VERIZON? Easy (oh, COOL, I got big, too!). Virgin Mobile asked for it that way.

We all know it's money. But customers have control over money, too. Just something to think about, very carefully, MotoRizon. You've locked me into another year to decide, (My guess is that you were fully aware of that at the time, but that doesn't matter for the sake of making your point, does it?) and this should make you very afraid. So what upsets you more, the fact that Verizon sells their phones and plans the way they do, or the fact that they are selling phones and service at the fast pace that they do? I promise you, they are not worried about the fanboy trolls such as yourself (I hate fanboys, regardless of their allegiance) crusin the 'Net wasting bandwidth on drivel and pablum such as this.

Mike

Mikey, let me lay out a scenario for that explains, more or less, the attitude of 99.5% of the people using mobile phone service these days.

Last Monday morning at 8am, I and my crew unloaded 3 trucks full of sound and lighting gear from last weekend, checked components, made a couple of repairs, and set about the duties for the week, which included service calls to several churches with sound or lighting problems, a projection system installation and another tweaking trip to the local minor league baseball stadium for a little more fine-tuning of the video and broadcast feeds (need more "Friends don't let video guys handle audio chores" bumper stickers). But wait...there's a call from a club...some band called "Seether" is coming in Wednesday and is asking for more PA than the club normally provides for those shows (And believe me, I found out why!). So it's back onto one of the semis with a fair-size PA for Wednesday, frantically calling clients and re-scheduling nearly (there's that word again) the entire week. Tuesday, we did what we could with in-house repairs and scheduled maintinience plus a couple of service calls. Wednesday, up at 5AM, turned out to be a 26-hour day because of size and space considerations. Friggin' loudest band I ever heard in my life, dealing with the local police and deputies because of volume issues ("Hey, I'm not mixing, their guy is!" barely kept me out of jail). Got to bed at 7AM Thursday morning, slept 2 hours, and phone and emails start flying. I handle some of that, take a nap after lunch and more calls and emails. Today, I tackle my desk at the shop and try to get back to the maintinience schedule again as we gather info and riders about a benefit show in Alabama for the tornado-stricken town. And Saturday is anyone's guess.....

Two things here. First, my phone worked perfectly. Voice, messages, emails, web (tracking thunderstorms with my phone on Wednesday with $250,000 worth of sound gear outdoors is worth what I'm paying Verizon for data) , all worked when I needed it to. And second, do I appear to be concerned with Madden's NFL or City Limits being on my phone.

I assure tou, working folks around here probably live like I do. And more or less, feel the same way I do about their phones. So it's a sure bet that yer little troll message has fallen on deaf (wait, I can't say that), okay, un-interested ears around here.

And it's set one of them off on a red-letter rampage. Feel the wrath, buddy....

Geri O

Ann154

Now that is one "red-letter" post!

BTW, Gerio, I have heard of Seether and often listen to a radio station that plays their music and similar styles.

hallcp1019

Lol you need to embed seethers paralyzer song in that post I had to stop halfway and get some popcorn. Well said but im not so sure he wasn't venting a little we all need to. I've used stock androids and honestly I do prefer a skin how many of these people wanting naked android really do anything on their phone for it to be beneficial? MOTOBLUR or the skin that shall not be uttered isn't that bad it runs smooth and I like it better than the sense skin on my evo 4g ....out of curiosity what is blur holding you back from to the point you praise a lackluster competitor ? I saw a story carriers make 30 cent on the dollar they charge for voice plans and 80 cent on the dollar for the data plans so yes vzw is reliable but they don't seem to mind milking our pockets

Jax_Omen

Yeah Seether's a fairly major band. Hard rock music. They're okay.

As for unskinned Android, I do a TON with my phone. I just prefer the AOSP UI to TouchWiz, Sense, or Blur.

gerio

I don't disagree with the venting angle, but let's be adult about it and without the condescending looking down Poindexter nose approach to the masses he's trying to make a point to.

As for Seether, I come from a jazz and orchestra background with an acquired taste for classic rock and roll and "some" country music, LOL. Let us just say that I found Seether to be "interesting"... :smileyhappy:

). Oh, yeah, and a really nice bunch o' guys.

Geri O

Jax_Omen

Haha, I can imagine they'd be quite a shock, coming from those musical tendencies! You'd probably hate the concert I'm going to next month, Disturbed, Megadeth, and Godsmack are all playing :smileytongue:

Ann154

Disturbed, Godsmack? Sweet!

At the same time, I will go to and enjoy a symphony performance of Mahler's Seventh.

Cody21

ha ha .. great post Gerio .. :smileyhappy:

curtterp

enjoyed the post Geri............. gave me a good laugh this morning :smileyvery-happy:

gerio

Thanx. (and sorry for the massive topic swerve)

Actually, we provide production for pretty much anyone, so I'm a little familiar with some of the recent rock bands. And while I'm not much of a rocker, I love a group called Rammstein. Odd, I know, but they do indeed rock.

And I almost made a crude reference tbeining kicked by virgins during my traveling days, but after the poster got censored for the reference about marrying the Droid X, I thought better of it. (Well, I really thought better of it without the help of that post, LOL)

Geri O

Jax_Omen

I saw Rammstein in concert last month. They put on an AMAZING show. Pyrotechnics, crazy stage antics... they're amazing :smileytongue:

MrMRM513

Thanks Geri O, for all your kind words. I respect your work on this forum, so I'll take a little time to respond to your comments. I hope you'll take as much time to read them as you did responding to my original post :smileywink: .

I've fixed personal computers in my community since before the internet. I've installed and repaired home networks since the introduction of that technology. Nowadays, I get about a dozen calls a week to fix something or give advice about some software or piece of equipment. Troubleshooting gets to be second nature, after a while. I do it for a living, too. I help run the Social Security Administration's video teleconference network. It's one of the largest in existence.

As you may imagine, mobile devices have become an increasingly popular topic. And, as any good technicain should, I do my homework. I scan about 2 dozen blog sites, technology news outlets, and fora for information on mobile technology from across the industry. Google, Apple, Android, iOS, Palm, Blackberry, Windows Mobile. I do this not because I'm obsessed with championing one brand over another, but becuase I believe in giving my customers, manyu of whom are my friends, the most options to find the best possible solutions based what they need and want. Some I steer towards Android, some towards Apple. A very few towards the Palm platform.

I look at carriers the same way. Some offer better connectivity, or terms, or customer service than others. It's part of the package. One doesn't run without the other.

Me? I chose Android becuase you can't swap out the battery on an iPhone yourself. To me, that's not only a design flaw, but a sign Apple wants to control the hardware they make, even though their customers purchase and own it. That kind of control bothers me. I'm not sure if that constitutes a fan boy attitude, but I bet many others feel the same way for similar reasons.

That said, I admit my post was trollish. I'd spent the previous week scanning the internet for responses to the latest updates to the DroidX. It's been ugly, particularly on the Motorola and Verizon DroidX fora. Motorola hosts at least 3 threads about GB update bugs with view counts in the low 4 figures. One post about spurious DX system reboots has 200,000 views (yes, two hundred thousand). That's not a blip caused by fan boy rants. That's a flag signalling a genuine and imporant issue on a user-dedicated forum. Those are paying customers gathering in that space and gravitating to that issue. And if you think they're all fan boys, Gerio, then we need to redefine the word.

Both my wife and I own a DroidX, as does my stepdaughter. Her kids own Droids, which have not yet recieved the update, but will. What happens with the X now is a pretty good indicator of what I can expect from my friends and clients who own those models. It won't be pretty. And it's mostly avoidable. Based on the research I've conducted across my sources, many of DXGB's problems stem from bugs introduced in the software Motorola modifies as part of its Blur skin. Verizon loads redundant and unnecessary software which most complain about and may, at minimum reduce battery life and OS performance by loading into memory, even when not activated by the user.

These problems affect every Droid X user. Even you, Gerio, though you may not know it. And they were introduced by the manufacturer and the carrier themselves. And no user can change that without voiding warranties or incurring penalties. That's flat out not right. If it is correct, then do we genuinely own that which we purchased? What then, constitutes ownership? These questions are imortant for every consumer, and not just those whose phones malfunction. And trust me, GeriO, that your phone is working "perfectly" (at least as you have described it) puts you in a small minority of the Droid X posting community.

To address your technical statements:

You wont' get a bill for using Google Maps, but you will if you use VZ Navigator. The services costs $9.99 per month. You don't need VZNav, but you can't get rid of it, either. And VZ makes **bleep** sure it's the initial default choice when mapping a contact.

The caller-ID bloat I reffered to is called City ID, which costs $2.99 per month. The dialer default caller ID is fine with me, but like VZNav, I can't get rid of City ID.

In the same paragraph, you frequently repeat the phrase "Don't open it, don't see it" in reference to many of Verizon's pre-loaded apps. Perhaps you won't see them, but that doesn't mean the programs aren't sitting in memory. City ID, VZNav, VZ Apps, and Skype Mobile load into memory at phone boot and variously throughout the device's uptime whether you activate them or not. I never use them, yet there they are, sucking up about 70MB of RAM. It takes processor cycles to load those apps, which drains your battery. So does flushing unused apps to clear that RAM for active sofware. And if your phone fails to clear enough RAM when loading a resource-heavy app like Maps, it can lock your device. It happens all the time, and to people who use their phones for more than just voice calls and weather checks in real-life work situations just like yours. Of course devices work "perfectly" if most demand so little of them. Cops, firefighters, EMTs, soldiers do demand more and will be relying on these devices for their work. They can't afford these kind of failures, but that doesn't mean we as customers just shrug and settle for it. And if knowing all these details about the Android OS makes me more a fan boy than a professional, I guess knowing all about how to schlep amps and hook up an audio mixer makes you a kind of fan boy, too.

On a more personal level, I directed my frustration towards Verizon, not you. But since you've drifted mighty close to making this a personal thing, please consider:

Knowing little or nothing about me, you assumed I was a fan boy and a troll. I can't tell if you've read any of my other posts, but you certainly never replied. Gerio shows up nowhere on any of the other Verizon threads to which I contributed. Word to the wise: at least do this stranger the courtesy of a background check before accusing him of being something you hate (your word). And by telling me you hate me as an alleged fan boy/troll, publicly, in an angry red-letter rant, you've crossed over to what you detest, smiley faces notwithstanding.

Okay, now that we both feel better, can we both agree to play nice, stay on topic, and breathe deep before hitting the Post button?

With respect,

Mike

bearone21

"City ID, VZNav, VZ Apps, and Skype Mobile", where are you seeing these, i don't see 'em in "my apps", as though they're running in the background.

Cody21

I use LPP and have those "hidden" via the Settings in LPP. Otherwise they show up in my APP drawer.

gerio

I'm doing my red-letter bit only to distinguish your statements and my responses. I'll start bny saying that if I didn't know better, I'd swear that your original post and this post were written by two different people. The attitude of this post would have gotten way more mileage, traction, and credibility than the way you wrote the OP. And regardless of how good and experienced you are (and I'll take your statements at face value, that's quite a resume!), how you write and how you approach a topic (especially when addressing other owners of the piece of equipment you are writing about) does matter and does establish a "first impression", if you will. And I have demonstrated more than once the willingness to start over a conversation..

And during the course of reading and responding to what you have written, it appears that this post isn't even about the same thing. The OP seemed to be about MotoBlur (or whatever skins) and yes, bloatware, I'll call it that, no problem, that either manufacturers or the carriers have chosen to include on the phones with no options to remove. This topic, more and more, appears to be about Gingerbread issues....?

MrMRM513 wrote:
Thanks Geri O, for all your kind words. I respect your work on this forum, so I'll take a little time to respond to your comments. I hope you'll take as much time to read them as you did responding to my original post .

I've fixed personal computers in my community since before the internet. I've installed and repaired home networks since the introduction of that technology. Nowadays, I get about a dozen calls a week to fix something or give advice about some software or piece of equipment. Troubleshooting gets to be second nature, after a while. I do it for a living, too. I help run the Social Security Administration's video teleconference network. It's one of the largest in existence.

As you may imagine, mobile devices have become an increasingly popular topic. And, as any good technicain should, I do my homework. I scan about 2 dozen blog sites, technology news outlets, and fora for information on mobile technology from across the industry. Google, Apple, Android, iOS, Palm, Blackberry, Windows Mobile. I do this not because I'm obsessed with championing one brand over another, but becuase I believe in giving my customers, manyu of whom are my friends, the most options to find the best possible solutions based what they need and want. Some I steer towards Android, some towards Apple. A very few towards the Palm platform.

I look at carriers the same way. Some offer better connectivity, or terms, or customer service than others. It's part of the package. One doesn't run without the other.

Me? I chose Android becuase you can't swap out the battery on an iPhone yourself. To me, that's not only a design flaw, but a sign Apple wants to control the hardware they make, even though their customers purchase and own it. That kind of control bothers me. I'm not sure if that constitutes a fan boy attitude (I'd say on that merit by itself, not at all), but I bet many others feel the same way for similar reasons.

That said, I admit my post was trollish. I'd spent the previous week scanning the internet for responses to the latest updates to the DroidX. It's been ugly, particularly on the Motorola and Verizon DroidX fora. Motorola hosts at least 3 threads about GB update bugs with view counts in the low 4 figures. One post about spurious DX system reboots has 200,000 views (yes, two hundred thousand) (Let me ask, where is it indicated that all of those views are from people that have problems?). That's not a blip caused by fan boy rants. That's a flag signalling a genuine and imporant issue on a user-dedicated forum. Those are paying customers gathering in that space and gravitating to that issue. And if you think they're all fan boys, Gerio, then we need to redefine the word.

Both my wife and I own a DroidX, as does my stepdaughter. Her kids own Droids, which have not yet recieved the update, but will. What happens with the X now is a pretty good indicator of what I can expect from my friends and clients who own those models. It won't be pretty. And it's mostly avoidable. Based on the research I've conducted across my sources, many of DXGB's problems stem from bugs introduced in the software Motorola modifies as part of its Blur skin. Verizon loads redundant and unnecessary software which most complain about and may, at minimum reduce battery life and OS performance by loading into memory, even when not activated by the user. (But here's the proverbial wrench in the works...I've updated 2 Xs to Gingerbread and I'm simply not seeing the problems that I know a lot of people are. So should I just sit here keeping my mouth shut and thanking my lucky stars? The forums are for engaging in dialogues between users and to interpret what you're saying, those of us fortunate enough to not have problems aren't allowed to participate. And Android is supposed to allocate memory based on what programs the user is, well, using at the time and not to programs that just sit there. My vocation is in Pro Audio and hence, I've become quite involved with Digital Audio, the equipment, and networking of digital audio gear (I can mix a show or change the settings of an installed system from my house, if I chose to set up the network that way...). I'm not as familiar with the inner workings of the Android OS, so I can't lay it out as eloquently as others here.

These problems affect every Droid X user. Even you, Gerio, though you may not know it. And they were introduced by the manufacturer and the carrier themselves. And no user can change that without voiding warranties or incurring penalties. That's flat out not right. If it is correct, then do we genuinely own that which we purchased? What then, constitutes ownership? These questions are imortant for every consumer, and not just those whose phones malfunction. And trust me, GeriO, that your phone is working "perfectly" (at least as you have described it) puts you in a small minority of the Droid X posting community. Putting words in my mouth. The issue that I kept seeing was the reboot when the X went from Landscape mode to Portrait. Every couple of weeks

To address your technical statements:

You wont' get a bill for using Google Maps, but you will if you use VZ Navigator. The services costs $9.99 per month. You don't need VZNav, but you can't get rid of it, either. And VZ makes **bleep** sure it's the initial default choice when mapping a contact. So where am I wrong?

The caller-ID bloat I reffered to is called City ID, which costs $2.99 per month. The dialer default caller ID is fine with me, but like VZNav, I can't get rid of City ID. Didn't say you could, again, where am I wrong?

In the same paragraph, you frequently repeat the phrase "Don't open it, don't see it" in reference to many of Verizon's pre-loaded apps. Perhaps you won't see them, but that doesn't mean the programs aren't sitting in memory. City ID, VZNav, VZ Apps, and Skype Mobile load into memory at phone boot and variously throughout the device's uptime whether you activate them or not. I never use them, yet there they are, sucking up about 70MB of RAM. It takes processor cycles to load those apps, which drains your battery. So does flushing unused apps to clear that RAM for active sofware. And if your phone fails to clear enough RAM when loading a resource-heavy app like Maps, it can lock your device. It happens all the time, and to people who use their phones for more than just voice calls and weather checks in real-life work situations just like yours. Of course devices work "perfectly" if most demand so little of them. Cops, firefighters, EMTs, soldiers do demand more and will be relying on these devices for their work. They can't afford these kind of failures, but that doesn't mean we as customers just shrug and settle for it. And if knowing all these details about the Android OS makes me more a fan boy than a professional, I guess knowing all about how to schlep amps and hook up an audio mixer makes you a kind of fan boy, too. But I don't give the appearance of sitting in my room readin audio magazines and pretending to be an expert about it, as a lot of fanboys appear when posting in the style of your first post. This post doesn't appear that way at all.

On a more personal level, I directed my frustration towards Verizon, not you. And you still aren't getting that you insulted the entire Droid X user population in your first sentence. But since you've drifted mighty close to making this a personal thing, please consider:

Knowing little or nothing about me, you assumed I was a fan boy and a troll. I can't tell if you've read any of my other posts, but you certainly never replied. Gerio shows up nowhere on any of the other Verizon threads to which I contributed. Word to the wise: at least do this stranger the courtesy of a background check before accusing him of being something you hate (your word). And by telling me you hate me as an alleged fan boy/troll, publicly, in an angry red-letter rant, you've crossed over to what you detest, smiley faces notwithstanding.

Okay, now that we both feel better, can we both agree to play nice, stay on topic, and breathe deep before hitting the Post button?

With respect,

Mike

Well, I was going to try and play along, but I see you still miss the point of my first post when it's all said and done. You wrote the original post, you ought to own up to it. Although I responded according to my interpretation of that post, it's clear you aren't a fanboy, but you can harbor all the animosity toward me you like. And to boot, I think you mis-understand how the Android memory system works. But that's going to be your problem from here on out.

My points, where they apply, still stand. You can figure that out on your own.

Geri O

curtterp

Mike -

We understand that you are not happy with what Verizon has done with the X. The software they do not allow you to uninstall, the blur that you do not like, and a few other things. We get that. You made that perfectly clear in the first post. But you also made some generalizations that offend some people. But you have your opinion, and we have our opinion.

But then you take offense to Geri's comments. He decided to share his frustration with your comments, just like you decided to share your frustrations with Verizon and Motorola.

You said in your second post that you decided not to get an iPhone because Apple doesn't allow you to change the battery. That it was Apple's desire to control the hardware that turned you off on them, but that is a part of Apples success. When they control the hardware and software, they can make sure that it all works together flawlessly. Verizon is doing the same think in principle, they can control the hardware/software that run on their networks. It is their business decision to do this. But they put software on their phones that you might want/not want. They also control your ability to uninstall it or not. Again, their business decision. They know that some people will nto be happy about it, but they count on the fact that people will choose their network, and not worry to much about what they can uninstall/not install.

So you do have a choice. You can go with Virgin Mobile, or another carrier or stay with Verizon. the choice is yours and your alone.

BTW, I too have been repairing computers since the DOS 3.3 days, the Apple System 6.7 days, and when token ring was so expensive, only Dr offices were willing to put that in. So yeah, I have been around the block a few times myself.

droidsw

And Seether's known for a song called "Rise About This". I think we should all do that.

Child Item