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Droid App Memory Limited to 256Mb - Ouch! We'll run out!!!

RedSox2010

After practically having my camp set up for Friday's Verizon release of the Droid as I just had to get my hands on one, I'm now concerned with application memory limitations.

For those of you who are technical - you know what I mean.

For those non-technical types, it refers to the amount of memory that you have available to store the "apps" you will download from the Android Market.

Currently the Droid is limited to 256Mb. No more, no less.

NOT 16GB!!! that is just your phone storage for Pics, Video, and MP3's...

The following link discusses the issue in greater depth:

http://androidandme.com/2009/10/news/google-fails-to-address-app-storage-issue-with-droid-and-android-2-0/

So with apps running at about 4-10Mb per app - you can quickly see you will reach this limit at about 25-28 apps.

That is for low end - smaller apps. Graphic intensive apps (the Droid has about the same graphics capability as the iPhone) will reduce that exponentially. So with a few games in the 50-70MB range and your down to about 7 apps.

This has caused me to hit the brakes on camping out for a new Droid. Do I want to run out of space for apps when there is a 16GB card installed in my device? No....

So I think I may wait until Verizon can work with Google to get this right for the Droid.

While there appears to be an argument over weather the Droid has the capability to store the executables for apps on the internal flash, while bulk content (like textures, audio files, maps, etc.) can be stored on SD. Not a single reference from Google (Android 2.0), Motorola, or Verizon support this claim! I want to see proof before I take the leap, otherwise, I'm just buying a new phone in a year anyway - that gets this combo right.

Outside of that - it was potentially the dream device for me! I know Verizon will never get the iPhone, and my BlackBerry has the same limitations listed above... So why change now, I want Verizon, Google, and Motorola to get it right!

Anyone else have thoughts on this...?

Comments

Samsungfan123

Just root the device. Problem solved. YAY!!!

RedSox2010

Sure - you could root it and whiel about 20% of us can do that - ROFL - the 80% that try and fail should be fun to watch!

(Not to mention Verizon voiding them when they come in dazed and confused to the dealer.

(androidcommunity.com yields over 2000+ results when doing a simple search for "android root problems".

Plus - rooting works to a point - but in itself is not flawless.

I like the 1 billion warnings sites with rooting instructions have...

And... while sure you can run the Verizon version of Android 2.0 anytime, Verizon will not support your root (ROFL).

Not to mention you probably will not receive system updates from Verizon, all data will be wiped when flashing a new Android build (you'll need to plan for backups before hand), and if you do not read and follow instructions exactly, you will have trouble.

The majority of users will like it because they always wanted an iPhone on Verizon and will NOT move to AT&T, but have little skill when it comes to hacking their phones.

For me - why should I pay to have to then root my phone - when it should be done right in the first place.

I'll either wait for the firmware to be upgraded to allow access to SD by apps, or wait for the Droid II.

fezzik

I have randomly searched the market I have looked at 20 apps and have yet to find one 2mb. Really I haven't found anything over 1.4 and that was a 3d game. World of Warcraft was under 1. The roughly 250 mb that you will have available to install apps does not include the ones already installed. In otherwords the really cool stuff like Google maps, facebook, Navigation, Google books, youtube, etc etc etc are already on there the 250mb is for other stuff and it looks like about an average of we'll call it 1.5 since I have to assume that since everyone is making such a fuss about this that there are some huge apps but so far of 20 apps the average is just under 1mb. We will go conservative and say that unless you build your own graphic intensive games or port apps from Linux for whatever crazy reason you may have you will be able to install roughly 100 apps in that space. Most of us will have fewer than 20 unless we really get crazy. Personally I am most excited about metal detector which is 42kb. Yeah with apps like that I will have caverns to work with.

crazy4trntitans

ok, I'm confused.....what does root mean??? And will you need a SD card to get the 16 g. thanks for any answers. I'm looking at it but don't know after reading your posts.

fezzik

Whoop found them. Margarita drop 7.9MB. Gang wars lite 2.9mb. I dare you 2.9MB XGalaxy2 full version 8.4MB. PacMan is for real 2.3MB what I don't think the original was that big. I don't think they thought in MB when Pac Man came out. LOL.

RedSox2010

ROFL - I saw that! Metal Detector App. Crazy.

Ultimately - I think this will get resoved in a firmware upgrade to Android 2.x, but I'm still cautions as I'm an app hog.

RedSox2010

Here's the deal - by the simple nature of you looking for input on websites to help you decide, you are already light years away from most.

Just be informed about what you are deciding and stay away from Hype. This phone appears to be great and with the limitation I mentioned above =- it still sizes up as a wicked phone by any standard.

WiFi, 5MP camera, DVD quality video (though I would like to see samples online recorded so I can SEE with my own eyes), and the SLEW of other good features will most likely mean you will be happy.

I'm a tough cookie to please and will jam that thing so full of apps, I just want to be sure I'm satisfied with the end game.

crazy4trntitans

I know I would probably have to upgrade to get the web, etc. (I don't have it now) like on a blackberry, but do I have to add the wi-fi?

Reusable

I read the link you referred to and it noted your concern, but only in reference to Games. Of course, I respect your desire to Game on your phone, but the 256Mb for apps doesn't seem to be a problem for those of us who want a phone for business and media.

fezzik

Understood. For me the Google apps are the ones I am most excited about. I am hoping for a barnes and Noble app and maybe a Kindle app soon mostly for my wife's sake but I kind of want it too. Beyond that everything else will pretty much be for fun. I don't play a lot of games and I will mostly have free apps cause that is just the kind of high roller I am . LOL. Put it this way I haven't had apps so I don't feel like I will be missing anything if I can only load say 50 to 100 apps. Like I say mine will more than likely only have about 20 or so beyond the Google and they will be toys like the metal detector and fake call me and fun stuff like that. Really looking in there at the kind of nerdy stuff I will load I will be able to put more than the phone has icon space for most likely. though I may have some productivity apps and finance apps too.

I guess my point in all of this is we both are reasonably informed on the issue but on opposite sides of the fence. I think most of the people who aren't informed that will buy this phone cause it is the hot thing more than likely won't fill it up. The apps will be and I think mostly are novelty fun toys and most people will be downloading silly stuff mostly with a few games (I imagine mob wars and Wow will be big downloads really) but your average joe won't know how much space he has until or if he reaches the limit and then I hope he will be smart enough to figure out how to get rid of some of the silly toys for stuff he really needs. (ok that may be a stretch for some people).

the thing that will be bad is most people won't know they need app killer. My understanding is the old Android had problems with when you close an app it doesn't die it goes to background until the memory gets full then it shuts down. Which is basically fine but if you want to keep it running fast and not bogged down in memory then app killer is a must. Much like task manager. That is what concernes me about the common man getting a Droid phone. they will think it is slow when really it just is bogged down.

DJA984

Root the phone or not - it doesn't matter. Developers aren't going to make large app's if the limit is 256megs. And like you said, I have yet to see anything about texture files for a certain app being stored on the SD card from a credible source. This very well may be the reason I jettison verizon and go with the proven iphone 3gs. Not an apple fan, but no one else is producing. It's kind of like the phillies in the last 3 games of the world series. Just not producing.

DJA984

Why would developers bother to make large apps when they will only be purchased or downloaded by less than 1% of the users? (Those who rooted the device)

daniel142005

256Mb is plenty. Most apps for Android are 0.2mb to 3mb, not 4 to 10. Games can be a bit larger, but just because the app INSTALLS on the phone does not mean it can not store graphics, video, sound, etc. on the SD card so that it does not waste your space.

This is what I have on my G1: (which has ~192mb instead of 256mb)

13 Games

23 Apps

With all of these apps I still have ~15mb of space left, and honestly, if you have 3G then you can remove them and re-download them later...

nickc50310

As others have said, files for large apps can be stored on the SD card. This is not as big of an issue as some are making it out to be. Also, you can root the device if needed. Also, this will likely be addressed soon enough by google. Also, the main culprit for filling it would be games. So... download emulators and store your roms on SD.

No reason to panic.

pkooistra76

Nick answered this well. Only executable files need to be stored in the ROM of the phone and all to the real content or Data can be stored on the SD card. Most apps keep a very small foot print in the ROM in Android apps. Developers know this restriction and they create apps with this in mind. This is a limitation put in by Google to try to limit pirating of apps. They would not have it on their phones if it crippled them the way you are thinking. Its not as big of a deal as it seems.

cdawg

The answer to the question..... seems "they" were listening..... relief soon....

http://phandroid.com/2009/11/03/google-iso-developers-for-app2sd/

ivorycruncher

cdawg wrote:
The answer to the question..... seems "they" were listening..... relief soon....

http://phandroid.com/2009/11/03/google-iso-developers-for-app2sd/

Eh, you beat me to posting that link. Yes, Google is working on solving this problem right now, and the final solution may have some extra bells and whistles too, like being able to swap out SD cards with different sets of apps. This is the beauty of an open platform. And I think it will take you longer than you think to actually fill up the initial 256MB of flash storage.

tubemonkey

Why didn't Google/Motorola just install 16GB onboard to begin with, instead of the mSD card approach? Then this wouldn't even be an issue. My preference would've been a device with 64GB hardwired onboard plus the mSD card slot. Now I have to seriously rethink if the Droid is for me.

Initially, I wanted an iPod touch for net access, apps, games, videos, and music when I traveled. So I waited a few months for the 3rd gen to see which "missing features" (camera, camcorder, mic, gps, compass, FM radio, WiFi n, mSD, replaceable battery) Apple would add. Lo and behold, none of them were added. How disappointing! So I moved on and started contemplating smartphones as my only other option to get the features I wanted. My major concern here was having to pay $30/mo for a data plan I really didn't need. WiFi is more than adequate for my needs.

The first phone to catch my attention was the Omnia 2. So I waited and waited and waited and waited until the Droid caught my attention. Then I discovered that the 16GB they kept hyping was in the form of a mSD card and that actual onboard RAM was a mere 256MB. How difficult is it to put 16-32-64GB onboard like Apple does?

Maybe it's time to rethink the touch again???

supitsmike

There is no reason to worry, my friend.

Apps, at most that I've ever seen come no larger than 8MB, and I assure you that you can put as much as you'd like to your hearts content, and not worry about it. Especially if the Verizon Droid has not only one but two processors (Which by the way is tremendously better than what the rest of us Android users have.)

There is rumored that next update, we'll be able to do Apps2SD. So since you guys have a huge SD card (That's also class 6), you'll have absolutely nothing to worry about.

farble1670

there is presently no way to root the droid.

farble1670

a common pattern for app developers is to provide a game stub that is downloaded / purchased from the market. the app then downloads its data files from the net, onto the SD card, when it is run for the first time. so most of the app ends up being on the SD card where it doesn't eat up the internal RAM. not all large apps do this however.

supitsmike

farble1670 wrote:
a common pattern for app developers is to provide a game stub that is downloaded / purchased from the market. the app then downloads its data files from the net, onto the SD card, when it is run for the first time. so most of the app ends up being on the SD card where it doesn't eat up the internal RAM. not all large apps do this however.

Little to no Apps do that now, what are you talking about o.O?

It is rumoured however, for Google to implement Apps2SD very soon, so we don't have to worry about it.

tubemonkey

supitsmike wrote:
There is no reason to worry, my friend.

Apps, at most that I've ever seen come no larger than 8MB, and I assure you that you can put as much as you'd like to your hearts content, and not worry about it.

There's a reason for that - they know the limitations imposed by the small amount of storage available on these phones. Why develop an app over 300MB when they know it can't be loaded?

Good games won't take off until Google hurries the App2SD fix.

Have you seen all the awesome iPhone and iPod Touch games? Hardly any of them would fit on an Android phone. It is not uncommon for popular titles to easily exceed 100 MB. For example, the game Myst takes up a whopping 727MB.

yewslus

You are all taking this a bit too seriously. Listen, if I can:

Access my home ftp and pull files,

Access my DESKTOP remotely from this phone and administer my home server,

Dial into PBX equipment for my job, and interface with a terminal emulator,

All while I listen to Pandora, look at street-view turn-by-turn directions, and find Andromeda,

then I am a happy camper.

Go play Myst on your home PC.

I have 42 applications that I have added since I got the phone on Friday. I still have 209MB remaining internally.

Most of my apps are caching to the memory card.

This is not an iPhone killer. Anyone who says that has no clue. This is a market expansion. This phone is among the first wave of Android sets to hit the market. By the time you're ready for a 5GB application, you'll sure as heck be using it on a different piece of hardware.

Enjoy it for what it is; a giant leap for those of us who have been in Bland Land with Verizon Wireless. The times, they are a changin'.

yewslus

Now, if someone would PLEASE tell me the path that the card uses to store music, I would appreciate it.

tubemonkey

yewslus wrote:

Go play Myst on your home PC.

Why? These are no longer just phones. They're now multimedia devices and it's not unrealistic to want large apps for better gaming.

yewslus

tubemonkey wrote:
Why? These are no longer just phones. They're now multimedia devices and it's not unrealistic to want large apps for better gaming.

Like I said, this is among the first of a new beast for Verizon. You'll see the hardware advance tremendously over the next year. It isn't unrealistic to want those kind of games, but it IS unfair to **bleep** the whole device over one (small) fault.

As a longtime VZW customer, I'm glad they opened up and did this. The visionaries that brokered this shift to open-source are vindicated.

supitsmike

tubemonkey wrote:
yewslus wrote:

Go play Myst on your home PC.

Why? These are no longer just phones. They're now multimedia devices and it's not unrealistic to want large apps for better gaming.

Whereas I can definitely see your concern and eye for the 'multimedia' part of it, you need to understand that yes, as of right now Android phones can't stick a 300MB in their phones because we don't have enough internal memory. But our SD cards do.

What I'm trying to come across here is that Google has already suggested, even hinted at allowing applications being saved to the SD card sooner than later.

androidtapp

Welcome to the issue all Android users face. The constant struggle of managing your apps to save space and the phone still performs. All other Android phones have between 192MB - 256MB.

Of course you can Root your phone but that comes with caution as you'll open the phone up for security risks. Most users are your average user and dont care/want to Root... they just want a Phone! And ironically not on the DROID Doesn't list.

The best thing we can do for now is keep an eye on internal memory usage and ditch apps we really dont need.

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