45 Miles From Closest Verizon Tower in Little Elm TX in 2024?

[senseiofsong]

Question:
It is currently 3/29/2024.
What is Verizon doing to improve service in Little Elm TX and is there a schedule?
What is the Verizon owned tower deployment plan for Little Elm and Denton TX, or is Verizon planning on leasing dark fiber to temp towers, or leasing space on existing towers in the area.?

Some Context & Details:
Just moved to Little Elm TX and was surprised to have only 1 (sometimes 2) bar(s) on my brand new Samsun S28 Ultra 5G phone. Makes it impossible to use the data, and frequently calls drop. The entire Highway 380 corridor is undergoing explosive growth from University of North Texas in Denton east towards McKinney TX (as are many of the areas within an hour outside of Dallas TX I see). I don't want to change carriers because for exact opposite reason years ago I left AT&T and went to Verizon because I lived in an area where there were no AT&T towers. I work for a carrier and lots of the work we do is either dark fiber or lit services to Verizon, AT&T, and T-Mobile towers in middle America  backhauling their circuits back to central offices where they can then interconnect back into their main voice network (DWDM transport or 100G ethernet). I am surprised that in 2024 the Verizon cell phone coverage on a new phone is so poor in Little Elm TX.  

[SynthpopAddict]

Sorry to hear there are no Verizon towers in Little Elm, TX.  I've seen CS reps saying that any network upgrade information is proprietary, so with the forums being public, they won't give you the answer to your question.  Your best bet is to ask your neighbors if any other carrier works better and port out to them.  It's a cell phone world now, so not really feasible to just have no service...

[vzw_customer_support]

We're sorry to read about the experience you're having in your area with service. We do not have any information on network improvements but we want to take a look at your concern. Has this been an issue since you moved into the area? How far from the area do you have to travel for service to be improved? ~Peter

[senseiofsong]

I live near the intersection of Highway 380 (University Drive) and South Paloma Creek Blvd.
When I called recently and talked to a Verizon service rep, and I gave them my number and home address they told me I was pinging 45 miles to the closest tower. I am finding that even if I drive all the way west to the University of North Texas at the intersection of Highway 380 (University Drive) and Interstate 35W, the signal is never more than 2 bars. I am lead to believe that if I drove closer towards Dallas the signal might improve. Neither of those matter since I am not spending time there in either location, but live in  Little Elm. 

Working in telecommunications for 30 years in everything from OSP (Outside Plant), NOC (Network Operations Center), Field Operations, Sales Engineering, IT, and Network Engineering and Leadership; I certainly understand that Verizon (or any carrier) will never post online "Here are our locations we intend to build towers" and lost competitive advantage (in their minds). Meanwhile, faithful customer need reliable cell phone signal for voice and data. 

I even told the rep that within the technology it is possible in the element managers to puyll reports and get the distance to tower from subscribers (cell phones and hot-spot users) and determine where the best next spots are to improve coverage. Solution architecture and capacity management and network growth was one of my talents at a company that Verizon bought, and then laid us all off.  

To other person that posted about talking to neighbors. Great idea. I have already been talking to folks in local businesses and neighbors, and they all had similar stories moving from Verizon tower plentify areas. Many of them just live with it because it works great in other areas they need to go. The other half I would say, have moved to third party carriers like Boost, Patriot, Cricket because those small companies claim to work on Verizon, AT&T and T-Mobile towers. I have no way to verify those claims other than what they say. 

If it does not improve I will do what I did when I moved in and immediately dumped Optimum Coaxial allegedly 1 Gbps internet service at the house, and went to AT&T true 1 Gbps Down/1 Gbps Down Synchronous service. I just hate to leave Verizon after having them and the service being great in so many places that I have lived. But, if I cannot get goo coverage, then that is the best reason. Even if I got something back privately from Verizon that stated, we hear you, you are not alone, and we are working on it, maybe by summer 2024 we hope to have service improved in your area. If not, they will lose 4 phones to another carrier. I have already checked, I can move my Samsung S28 Ultra to other carriers. 

[vzw_customer_support]

senseiofsong, thank you for the extra information. We want to make sure you're getting the best service possible at all times, and we're definitely going to do everything we can to help you. We don't have information on any planned improvements as that information is proprietary and not available. First, we recommend troubleshooting. You can find your devide using this link and go to our troubleshooting guide: https://www.verizon.com/support/devices/ Please let us know once you troubleshoot and if your service improves.

~Jesse

[SynthpopAddict]

Jesse, the OP has already done troubleshooting based upon their earlier posts, so I highly doubt it is their phone.  With Verizon and all other carriers shutting down 3G a couple years ago and more and more devices connecting to wireless networks, holes in coverage are cropping up more often.  I am astonished that @senseiofsong  was told their phone was connecting to a tower 45 miles away.  That's the theoretical limit for distance 4G LTE signal travels; in real life it must surely be less due to assorted things absorbing the radio waves to some extent.

Until additional network resources are installed, the only real fixes for poor signal strength are 1) get a 4G network extender from Verizon, 2) install an (expensive) 3rd party cell phone signal booster system in one's home, or 3) switch carriers to someone who has better service.  Considering that it was mentioned they already have fiber optic internet service with a competitor, might want to consider going to them for cell phone service too as one could probably get a bundle discount that way?  I know they said they didn't really want to port out, but it's a cell phone world now so you have to have your phone working.  Of course, said competitor also just got hacked a couple days ago and last month had a massive network outage...

[senseiofsong]

It is definitely not my new Samsung Galaxy S24 Ultra.
I made calls recently in other areas while traveling south of Flower Mound TX. Full bars.
Nor is it the other three phones we have with Verizon.
Nor is it my neighbors's phones.
Nor is it the phones of anyone that I have talked to asking them about what provider they use.
The coverage is simply poor in this area. I get it.

The AT&T technician and a sales-rep just left as they were out here cleaning their fiber and running a test-set/OTDR on their FTTH because there was a pinch between their ONT and their cabinet at the front of the neighborhood. They want me to switch to AT&T for cell phone.
Admittedly they said that coverage in Little Elm is not great ("same as Verizon" his words).
But what he proposed for cell is a savings of $100.00 a month to me. That cuts my bill in half.
And AT&T executives live in TX so generally they say the coverage is better. 
I am also not interested in deploying a Femtocell device (small cell) off my AT&T FTTH to improve everyone else's coverage.
If there is no plan to deploy more towers or nobody can tell me anything if there is, I have to assume there is not.
So maybe if the coverage is going to be the same between Verizon, AT&T, and any other carrier for unlimited for 4 phones, maybe the best I can do is cut my bill in half, for all my troubles and loyalty.
Maybe I should start a dark fiber and tower business. 
Thanks all. I guess I know what I need to do.

[vzw_customer_support]

Thank you for those additional details Senseiofsong. As previously mentioned Planning and Development is not public knowledge, even in this department we do not know what is ours and being worked until the tower is activated. You seem well educated in this area but for the sake of having all the bases covered, do you have roaming on so you're able to connect with towers closer to you that my not be operated by us? 

-Melissa

[SynthpopAddict]

If roaming is turned on, won't they be incurring potentially huge charges for using other towers?

Wow, so AT&T said their coverage wasn't any better than Verizon in Little Elm? 😮  In that case, the only benefit is paying less for crummy service.  Have the neighbors said anything about the 3rd guy working any better?  Hard to believe that nobody can get decent cellular service there...but if that's true, maybe it's time to ask the local elected representatives about putting up a bill for adding cell towers if there is not enough infrastructure out there for any carrier to use.  All the carriers rent space on towers these days unless I'm mistaken.

[vzw_customer_support]

SynthpopAddict, there is usually no charge for roaming within the United States. There would only be charges if you're roaming on an international carrier. For example, if you're too close to the Mexican or Canadian border and your plan doesn't cover Mexico and Canada. 

~Jesse

[senseiofsong]

Settings > Connections > Mobile Networks > Data Roaming Access (Connect to mobile networks while roaming). ENABLED.

Network Operators > Select Automatically
(Let your phone choose the best mobile network for you. ...).
ENABLED

Wi-Fi Calling
DISABLED

eSIM 3
This is where my number appears

[vzw_customer_support]

@senseiofsong  wrote: Settings > Connections > Mobile Networks > Data Roaming Access (Connect to mobile networks while roaming). ENABLED.

Thanks for checking, and sharing. I did review the area you shared, and based on the US Highway 380, South Paloma Road intersection mentioned there are numerous cellular sites, along that route and far less than 45-miles away, most within 1-4 miles. I'm sorry that an earlier contact was giving out some confusing info about that. 

If your having signal issues, then we can look at things with our network tools. To do that, we do want to get into the account. I'm sending a Private Message, so we can work on that together. As it'd be disheartening to have you switch, without a better look at things. 

-John

[senseiofsong]

So to wrap this up and try to close this thread:

*Verizon does not share tower deployment locations or time lines. I get it, being a carrier and network guy myself for 30 years. Operational Security. First to market.

*If Wi-Fi calling works for you to your home router, knock yourself out. My experience is that calls do not come through or go out reliably and voicemail alerts do not show up on my Android when Wi-Fi calling is the primary source. You can mess around now in current Android OS to setup primary/secondary/failover for calling. My experience is, it does not work great or reliably. And my feeling is, I should not have to do that anyway.

*Femtocall ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Femtocell ) is something that Verizon does, but then anyone that can hit that Small-Cell station is then using your bandwidth with whomever your home-internet provider is (AT&T FTTH, Comcast, Optimum, Spectrum, whomever). 

*What I was told by the Verizon rep that I initially called in and spoke to was incorrect. I am not 45 miles from the closest tower based on my home address, and I am within 2 to 3 miles of a Verizon tower. Which initially sounds great. But the fact that I get 1 to 2 bars is till not great if I am truly that close.

*I was told that while past cell phone technologies worked great, the generations of tech are good for some things and not for others. And told that the evolution of the networks have been:
LTE > 3G > 5G (Wideband), and now 5G (Ultrawideband).
And that while people in the past have expected to be able to take and make calls while indoors, the newer radio technology is not always the best for being able to make cell phone calls or certainly get 5 full bars indoors. Again, because I am techno-nerd, this is peripherally interesting to me, but not ultimately helpful. Also, I have the same issue in my house, in my driveway, up the street, and driving along highway 380 miles away going wast towards Denton TX or east towards McKinny TX . So there goes the "it's because you are indoors" or inside a concrete and steel building downtown or beneath street level.

*I was told that more and more Verizon finds that people are relying on their cell phones to use them for data, and less and less for phones. Those points can be argued depending on who you are, how old you are, what you do for a living, and if you work remotely (calls now being more and more things like Webex and MS-Teams, and people not all having unlimited voice plans). This data again is interesting in discussion, but does not improve my service unfortunately.

*I will not go down the rabbit hole of radio-waves, line of sight, scattering, and reflectance over bodies of water, user or subscriber load, how crowded the electromagnetic frequency range in my and more and more areas, but those are things to. Ever had to change your wireless N frequencies because your neighbors are using the same frequencies? Similar.

I appreciate everyone's help, users (Verizon subscribers) and Verizon (the company proper).
But for me and my family all having brand new Android phones, service is 1 to 2 bars at home, in the driveway, in the neighborhood, across Little Elm Texas, and in nearby areas along highway 380. That is not great. Not going to inspire me to be an evangelist for Verizon (or any carrier) in this area. I will continue to look at my options before changing carriers. Cost is not the issue, although there is some money to be saved if changing (at least for me I found). Having to look at all these little hacks to try and get 5 bars or accept lowered expectations, is not really something I have the time/money/desire/interest in. If I move in a few years to an area where another carrier has poor service, then another switch would be required, and I hate that. I did that years ago when I moved to Naples FL where AT&T had no towers and all calls dropped, in 2007-ish, that is when I made the jump to Verizon. Wife was already on them. Brand loyalty might be appreciated, but means nothing frankly. I was a Ford loyalist, until I had to replace the plastic oil pan 4 times. 

Do your research before choosing carriers, and buy your own phones. Don't ever get locked into a contract. Because if you move to an area with poor coverage, you will pay to leave.  

[Shaun22]

Strange question but could it be the lake surrounding us?

[SynthpopAddict]

Possibly.  Why Verizon's signal can get absorbed by lakes I don't know, but I've seen another thread from some time ago where the person lived by a lake and everyone there knew Verizon was no good.  Meanwhile, a certain competitor had no service issues at all.  Must be something to do with differences in the network technology, or different radio bands being used.

[vzw_customer_support]

That's a great question. Large bodies of water can definitely impact your signal. The following link will provide you with additional details. https://www.verizon.com/support/troubleshooting-wireless-signal-coverage-video/

~Geo