Problems since April

[rboehm]

I continually have issues with the DSL dropping out or loss of IP address. This has been happening since mid-April this year. Every day between 7 and 9 AM and 3 and 8 PM are the worst. I have had technicians come out and say line is fine. I have called daily to tech support and get read from the book. Shutdown computer, reboot modem and router, and restart computer. Every time I go through this procedure. They mention a 24 hour line test and the promises of a call back. My modem speed is near 1.5 down and 384k up after a modem reset. But when the DSL drops out (light flashing) or a loss of IP address, I get dropped down in speed. As of this moment, I am at 256k down and 300+ up speeds. They do not want me resetting the modem to get my speeds back.

I guess my real issue beyond the length of time to fix the issue is that I have spotted the time of day the issues occur, yet I have to go through the routine mentioned above. Call tech support, get read the routine and have them do a 24 hour line test. I do not have a timeclock or anything like that on the phone line and have replaced the filters. I only use one land line and an All-in-One printer that has fax. The printer is not even connected to the phone line and I still have issues.

My fix for when the DSL drops out is to reconnect and/or reboot modem. But it gets very frustrating to have to do this 5 or 6 times a day and at the times I noted. I am near the point of changing providers, but a part of me don't want the headaches of new email, and changing all my information on forums, etc.

They did a port swap at the CO and it got worse and more predictable.

What does it take to get a real fix?

[dslr595148]

#1 Log-in to the Westell 6100.

#2 Which one do you have ( The White and Blue OR the Red and Black Firmware) ?

[rboehm]

I have the Westell 6100 white and blue.

Can you tell me what differences there are between the two versions?

[dslr595148]

#1 In the modem combo go to Troubleshooting -> Transceiver Status.

#2 Post the info that is there.

[herrmannre]

Had issues from Aug 2009 to March 2010 & now have issues again.  This is all en external verizon DSL isssue.  They refused to address this.   I finally managed to have them acknowledge that this was their problem and NOT mine.  This time around I will not be so kind or patient.

They need to fix this problem as we are not alone.

[rboehm]

Transceiver Revision: 7.1.254                  
Vendor ID Code:        4                 
Line Mode:               G.DMT-Mode                 
Data Path:               Interleaved                 
Transceiver Information     Down Stream Path     Up Stream Path       
DSL Speed (Kbits/Sec)     1216    448       
Margin (db)     17    12       
Line Attenuation (db)     55.5    18.5       
Transmit Power (db/Hz)     13    11    

I reverted back to my 2200. Per the request of the service tech, he said when it got bad to switch back. So these stats from my 2200.

Tonight was so bad that there was crossover from the DSL to voice. I could hear my wife on Skype (when we did have a connection) and the land line stayed "off hook" even when the modem was disconnected.

Wiring in the house is a home run from the modem and we are using new filters.

[dslr595148]

---

@rboehm wrote:

Transceiver Revision: 7.1.254                  
Vendor ID Code:        4                 
Line Mode:               G.DMT-Mode                 
Data Path:               Interleaved                 
Transceiver Information     Down Stream Path     Up Stream Path       
DSL Speed (Kbits/Sec)     1216    448       
Margin (db)     17    12       
Line Attenuation (db)     55.5    18.5       
Transmit Power (db/Hz)     13    11    

I reverted back to my 2200. Per the request of the service tech, he said when it got bad to switch back. So these stats from my 2200.

Tonight was so bad that there was crossover from the DSL to voice. I could hear my wife on Skype (when we did have a connection) and the land line stayed "off hook" even when the modem was disconnected.

Wiring in the house is a home run from the modem and we are using new filters.

---

Hmm..

If you have one dsl line you can only use one of those two DSL modems at a time.

I am just wondering something. Please follow my steps / answer my questions.

#1 Check the IP Address, Subnet Mask, Default Gateway, and DNS Servers on your computer.

This means for example if on Windows XP:

a) Go to Start -> Run.

b) Type in cmd and press enter.

c) In the new window, called the command prompt, type in ipconfig /all and press enter.

#2 If the default gateway on your computer is not the same IP Address of your Westell modem then you are Double NATTED.

#3 If you are Double NATTED:

a) I know that your Westell is connected to the phone line and power line / power supply.

b) What else (brand and model number) is connected to the Westell, besides the things that I listed?

#4 If you are or are not Double NATED, why did you get this Westell 6100 for?

Thanks.

[rboehm]

I have been without internet and voice line since Saturday. I am at work now so I will answer what I can.

I got the Westell 6100 just in case the 2200 was faulty. Both modems do the same thing as I have the same issue. I know that only one modem can be connected to the phone line at a time, but thanks for the reminder.

The modem is in bridge mode as I have a Linksys WRT54-GL wireless router. The router is setup as a PPoE device with DHCP enabled. And that is all that is connected to the modem.

My question is, can I get the information from the modem when it is in bridge mode?

I will check my IP config information once I am home and know I have a connection.

Thanks for your help.

[dslr595148]

---

@rboehm wrote:

My question is, can I get the information from the modem when it is in bridge mode?

---

I point to

http://www.dslreports.com/faq/7267

[rboehm]

That worked for getting to the modem, but not being able to see the gateway and DNS.

The WRT54GL has a screen where these are shown and they match my information from my " ipconfig /all" except the default gateway. The difference there is my Linksys IP address is the default gateway on my pc whereas the Linksys has a different gateway address.

DNS1 = 68.237.161.12

DNS2 = 71.250.0.12

Sorry for not being able to get this info off of the modem. Any help in getting that from the modem?

Also, another silly question. How does double natting affect DSL synch? I lose DSL connectivity, not just IP address.

Thanks.

[dslr595148]

---

@rboehm wrote:

That worked for getting to the modem, but not being able to see the gateway and DNS.

The WRT54GL has a screen where these are shown and they match my information from my " ipconfig /all" except the default gateway. The difference there is my Linksys IP address is the default gateway on my pc whereas the Linksys has a different gateway address.

DNS1 = 68.237.161.12

DNS2 = 71.250.0.12

Sorry for not being able to get this info off of the modem. Any help in getting that from the modem?

---

I lost you, please explain.

---

@rboehm wrote:

Also, another silly question. How does double natting affect DSL synch? I lose DSL connectivity, not just IP address.

Thanks.

---

Double NATTING does not affect DSL synch, as I am Double NATTED (2 RJ-45 WAN port routers. Linksys WRT54G and DYNEX DX-E402) and my connection is not loosing DSL connectivity.

[rboehm]

I could not find a way to get the information off of the modem as you requested. The setup to get through to the modem worked in that I could connect to the modem and run the interface. But nowhere did I see the information you requested. One feature of the WRT54GL shows the DNS and default gateways. I would assume that these are being passed through the modem to the router. The addresses I saw in the router matched what I saw in my pc using ipconfig/all as you suggested. The difference between the two was my default gateway. The default gateway on the router was a different number whereas the default gateway on my pc was the address of my router. This is what I would expect to see. But you would know better than I.

Perhaps I did not explain that I lose DSL synch often. Usually between 7 and 9 AM and between 3 and 8 PM. I have looked high and low for any device in my house that may interfere and see none. No security, no running of wires through ductwork, etc. Also, my DSL line is a straight home run to the splitter. Since I have the home run, I have tried using my POTS with and without the filters to no avail.

As of this AM, my speed is now down to 23Kb. The speed decrease usually happens after a synch loss and sunsequent resynch. That is less than dial-up. I am posting from work as it is taking 10 or more minutes to load this page. I am currently working with Verizon technicians to try and solve this issue. So far, they have swapped ports, changed CO routers (?), swapped underground and aerial lines and swapped the splitter.

I am only 12000 feet from the CO and provisioned at 1.5 Mb but the line tests show that I should be able to achieve 3.0Mb as the techs have said it shows the capability of in the 4.0 Mb range.

[dslr595148]

---

@rboehm wrote:

I could not find a way to get the information off of the modem as you requested. The setup to get through to the modem worked in that I could connect to the modem and run the interface. But nowhere did I see the information you requested. One feature of the WRT54GL shows the DNS and default gateways. I would assume that these are being passed through the modem to the router. The addresses I saw in the router matched what I saw in my pc using ipconfig/all as you suggested. The difference between the two was my default gateway. The default gateway on the router was a different number whereas the default gateway on my pc was the address of my router. This is what I would expect to see. But you would know better than I.

---

Ok.

#1 In the Linksys go to Status -> Router.

#2 If the modem is in bridge modem:

a) the IP Address that you see at http://whatismyipaddress.com/ should be in your Linksys router at this screen.

b)  In the modem, you will not see the Default gateway or DNS Servers.

---

@rboehm wrote:

Perhaps I did not explain that I lose DSL synch often. Usually between 7 and 9 AM and between 3 and 8 PM. I have looked high and low for any device in my house that may interfere and see none. No security, no running of wires through ductwork, etc. Also, my DSL line is a straight home run to the splitter. Since I have the home run, I have tried using my POTS with and without the filters to no avail.

---

Did you try connecting directly to the NID?

Points to http://www.dslreports.com/faq/1317

How is your modem stats, when you do that?

This info, for example was your modem stats (earlier post)

---

Transceiver Revision: 7.1.254                  
Vendor ID Code:        4                 
Line Mode:               G.DMT-Mode                 
Data Path:               Interleaved                 
Transceiver Information     Down Stream Path     Up Stream Path       
DSL Speed (Kbits/Sec)     1216    448       
Margin (db)     17    12       
Line Attenuation (db)     55.5    18.5       
Transmit Power (db/Hz)     13    11   

---

[rboehm]

I mis-read your earlier request for ip address so that is why I went to looking for the DNS information. Sorry.

The ip addresses do match, so we are good there and I am not double natted.

Getting the modem to the NID will be a challenge as there is no power nearby and I am connected to a desktop pc. I will have to borrow my work laptop to do the test. It may take a day or two.

The technician is supposed to bring a new modem today. I will post those results after it gets installed. and see if issues go away. If not, then I will persue the method you suggest by plugging into the NID directly. So bear with me as I divert based on the technician's request.

[rboehm]

The Verizon tech measured inside as well as outside at the NID. Both values were the same. After a replacement to a Westell 7500, the problems still exist. He called someone in Boston or Providence and had them check my router (Verizon) and lines. The person he talked to stated the group I was one was listed as congested, so he did a swap to another less congested one. Yet the problem still persists.

One note was the tech mentioned a software thing that Verizon is doing that will drop the comm rate if it determines there is a problem in order to avoid "issues". The tech said that the dropping of bitrate would cause the DSL synch to go out and then reconnect. As this appears to be what is happening to me as I see a drop in bitrate each time the DSL goes out of synch. So this answers the why, but not how to fix it.

I doubt you can help me further with this problem, so I will drop the thread as it stands. It is not resolved, so I cannot check it off as solved.

Not sure where I'll go from here. Looks like another ISP if not resolved in the next couple of weeks.

Thanks for your patience and assistance. Kudos coming.

[Hubrisnxs]

---

@rboehm wrote:

The Verizon tech measured inside as well as outside at the NID. Both values were the same. After a replacement to a Westell 7500, the problems still exist. He called someone in Boston or Providence and had them check my router (Verizon) and lines. The person he talked to stated the group I was one was listed as congested, so he did a swap to another less congested one. Yet the problem still persists.

One note was the tech mentioned a software thing that Verizon is doing that will drop the comm rate if it determines there is a problem in order to avoid "issues". The tech said that the dropping of bitrate would cause the DSL synch to go out and then reconnect. As this appears to be what is happening to me as I see a drop in bitrate each time the DSL goes out of synch. So this answers the why, but not how to fix it.

I doubt you can help me further with this problem, so I will drop the thread as it stands. It is not resolved, so I cannot check it off as solved.

Not sure where I'll go from here. Looks like another ISP if not resolved in the next couple of weeks.

Thanks for your patience and assistance. Kudos coming.

---

The problem is definetely not at the ISP side,  the problem is definetely the line.   

Transceiver Revision: 7.1.254                  
Vendor ID Code:        4                 
Line Mode:               G.DMT-Mode                 
Data Path:               Interleaved                 
Transceiver Information     Down Stream Path     Up Stream Path       
DSL Speed (Kbits/Sec)     1216    448       
Margin (db)     17    12       
Line Attenuation (db)     55.5    18.5       
Transmit Power (db/Hz)     13    11  

the readings themselves look deceptively ok, because the attenuation and the margin (db) look ok, but the down rate for a 1.5 plan should be 1792. not 1200. 

DSL fluctuates, so when life is good for you, you see a like speed that immediately indicates that there is trouble somewhere in the line.   when things get really bad, go back to that same page and look at those stats again and you'll see that 1216 get REAL bad, is what I would bet.

when the tech's get out there, they need to do a process of elimination.   They either need to replace the cables outside on the pole, or the cables in the street to the main office, and maybe the card that you are plugged into at the main office.  

The only way that it could be you're house, is if you disconnect every single phone/alarm system/fax/etc   and plug in only the modem to a jack at the house, and then the readings go UP, then it's a problem with one of your phones or filters.    

if the readings look the same or identical then the problem is likely outside of your house, and more in line with the things I talked about before. 

I wouldn't suggest messing with any of the settings, this is definetely a physical issue in some respect.  

[rboehm]

---

@Hubrisnxs wrote:

---

@rboehm wrote:

The Verizon tech measured inside as well as outside at the NID. Both values were the same. After a replacement to a Westell 7500, the problems still exist. He called someone in Boston or Providence and had them check my router (Verizon) and lines. The person he talked to stated the group I was one was listed as congested, so he did a swap to another less congested one. Yet the problem still persists.

One note was the tech mentioned a software thing that Verizon is doing that will drop the comm rate if it determines there is a problem in order to avoid "issues". The tech said that the dropping of bitrate would cause the DSL synch to go out and then reconnect. As this appears to be what is happening to me as I see a drop in bitrate each time the DSL goes out of synch. So this answers the why, but not how to fix it.

I doubt you can help me further with this problem, so I will drop the thread as it stands. It is not resolved, so I cannot check it off as solved.

Not sure where I'll go from here. Looks like another ISP if not resolved in the next couple of weeks.

Thanks for your patience and assistance. Kudos coming.

---

The problem is definetely not at the ISP side,  the problem is definetely the line.   

Transceiver Revision: 7.1.254                  
Vendor ID Code:        4                 
Line Mode:               G.DMT-Mode                 
Data Path:               Interleaved                 
Transceiver Information     Down Stream Path     Up Stream Path       
DSL Speed (Kbits/Sec)     1216    448       
Margin (db)     17    12       
Line Attenuation (db)     55.5    18.5       
Transmit Power (db/Hz)     13    11  

the readings themselves look deceptively ok, because the attenuation and the margin (db) look ok, but the down rate for a 1.5 plan should be 1792. not 1200. 

DSL fluctuates, so when life is good for you, you see a like speed that immediately indicates that there is trouble somewhere in the line.   when things get really bad, go back to that same page and look at those stats again and you'll see that 1216 get REAL bad, is what I would bet.

when the tech's get out there, they need to do a process of elimination.   They either need to replace the cables outside on the pole, or the cables in the street to the main office, and maybe the card that you are plugged into at the main office.  

The only way that it could be you're house, is if you disconnect every single phone/alarm system/fax/etc   and plug in only the modem to a jack at the house, and then the readings go UP, then it's a problem with one of your phones or filters.    

if the readings look the same or identical then the problem is likely outside of your house, and more in line with the things I talked about before. 

I wouldn't suggest messing with any of the settings, this is definetely a physical issue in some respect.  

---

Yes, I fully understand. He had asked for my readings at that time. It so happened to coincide with what the tech saw inside and outside. I have seen modem stats as low as 440 is kbs. I do know it has been lower but did not record the stats.

As I mentioned in this thread, they did replace everything - Port swap, underground line, aerial line, splitter and router assignment along with modem. Problems still exist and are daily, though not as bad. I think the CO router swap helped the most. I still can only achieve 1501 kbs at max which I know is still lower than the 1792 I used to see. I still have DSL synch issues, but I now believe that is the magic software they use to "optimize" my connection to eliminate communications errors. The loss of synch is brief and when it reconnects, the speed is dropped and will continue to drop until it thinks I am at a stable communications rate.

As I understand it, they pretty much have done everything and yet the problem still exists. I have had at least 10 tech visits and my records show my long lasting issues. Even the call center in India recognizes that now.

As it stands right now here are my best stats which also appears to be the most stable with the Westell 7500.

Transceiver Information	Down Stream Path	Up Stream Path
DSL Speed (Kbits/Sec)	1501	445
Margin (dB)	8.8	20.2
Line Attenuation (dB)	59.5	32.2
Transmit Power (dBm)	17.6	12.4

Like I said, I doubt there is any more help here and it is in Verizon's hands.

[Hubrisnxs]

be forewarned, this will be a few visits until the replace the bad item, whether that is a card in the central office, remove bridge tap, or replace a cable on the pole.   unless you can raise enough stink and get them to replace it all at one time.    

[rboehm]

herrmannre don't even get me started. This is the third or fourth long stretch of DSL issues. Not counting short term ones. Beyond that, we had voice line issues as well for almost a year. There would be a low grade static and gradually it would increase in volume until you could almost not hear then a click followed by the static low and increasing again. It would cycle over and over.

The tech gave me a local contact number for people with long term issues and they will not return my calls.