Extended storage(esata) on DVR.

[mistrhanky]

I have not made the switch yet to FIOS because of the very poor space limitations on them. However, when I chatted with someone in the verizon online chat today, I got the attached response. Can someone, preferably from Verizon, also confirm this is true? Can you in fact add your own hard drive through the ESATA port now?

Didn't seem to like myh image. Here is the direct link. http://www.mistrhanky.com/verizonchat.jpg

Message Edited by mistrhanky on 12-19-2008 08:41 PM

[Stew]

Unless the earth has been moved off it's axis, there isn't a Motorola DVR anywhere that has an active ESATA port. The best you could do would be to go with TIVO if you're looking for additional space.

[mistrhanky]

LOL. Yeah, that is basically why I put it up. Since two different verizon reps have now told me it is supported. By the way, do you happen to know if you you can view the content from a home media dvr on another hd dvr? In other words, if I have the home media dvr, and another hd dvr box from Verizon, when I try and watch media from the HM dvr that was recorded in HD, will I be able to watch it remotely in HD?

Anyway, thanks for the help. I don't know if you read the link to my chat or not, but they are clearly saying the do support the extended space now, but I wonder if that is just a salesperson saying anything to get a sale...

[KenAF]

---

@mistrhanky wrote:

LOL. Yeah, that is basically why I put it up. Since two different verizon reps have now told me it is supported. By the way, do you happen to know if you you can view the content from a home media dvr on another hd dvr? In other words, if I have the home media dvr, and another hd dvr box from Verizon, when I try and watch media from the HM dvr that was recorded in HD, will I be able to watch it remotely in HD?

Anyway, thanks for the help. I don't know if you read the link to my chat or not, but they are clearly saying the do support the extended space now, but I wonder if that is just a salesperson saying anything to get a sale...

---

 As of last night, Verizon's DVRs do not support eSATA expansion.  I'm not aware of any Motorola DVR from any provider in the U.S. with functional eSATA support today.

You cannot share media on the home media DVR with another DVR.  Media sharing is only available with the SD and HD STBs at this time. 

[mistrhanky]

Wow. That is worse than I thought. I thought it was just a matter of whether the HD content would stream in hd or not. I did not realize a dvr box could not pull from the HM dvr. Thanks for your help.

[D1]

Any word on the activation of the Esata port?

I called tech support a couple of nights ago, and was informed it isn't active at this time; but, the tech support rep didn't seem very knowledgeable regarding this subject so, I wanted to see if there is any updated and accurate information with this port.

[Joe01880]

---

@D1 wrote:

Any word on the activation of the Esata port?

---

No!

[prisaz]

Perhaps when Motorola can make it work, Verizon and others can start to use the ports for expanded recording. I think many of the issues revolve around HDCP. Ever try Blueray with the wrong video card.

Message Edited by prisaz on 03-20-2009 05:52 PM

[CharlesH]

HDCP is the devil. It's all about the industry not standardizing HDMI completely.

Message Edited by CharlesH on 03-20-2009 06:02 PM

[hofs1]

If HDCP is such the issue with hdmi and dvr and esata use..........why is it that Scientific Atlanta can make it work on their hdmi capable dvr?????????? Its all about Motorola not wanting to  actually fix or enable the option thats all its about they put the port on the box when they designed didnt they???????

[CharlesH]

Well hdcp has nothing to do with estata, but esata/usb/firewire why it was never implemented in the get-go is beyond me.

[prisaz]

---

@hofs1 wrote:
If HDCP is such the issue with hdmi and dvr and esata use..........why is it that Scientific Atlanta can make it work on their hdmi capable dvr?????????? Its all about Motorola not wanting to  actually fix or enable the option thats all its about they put the port on the box when they designed didnt they???????

---

I will not disagree with you on that!

Yes it is digital rights management. Which HDCP has much to do with. HDCP does have soem things to do with rights management. But not E-sata directly.

Verizon can not use a feature that Motorola can not enable because prehaps their hardware can not be made HDCP compliant. Just my guess. Yes Motorola. Perhaps soon we will have other options. Right now it's Motorola or Tivo. I had to change the video card in my PC becuase of HDCP compliance with BlueRay. I imagine if there were hardware issues with Motorola's hardware compliance it could be the problem they cant fix without redesigning the box and trashing existing boxes. If HDCP was not an issue everyone would be putting out cable card capable tuners for PCs. I for one being a system builder would love to see it. But it all goes back to hardware compliance. Bites don't it!

Message Edited by prisaz on 03-21-2009 01:56 PM

[cjacobs001]

digital rights management may be the issue.  - If the ports were useable and a customer copied a movie over to an attached storage device, then detached that device and played it elsewhere or made copies of it, who is enabling the piracy ?      Now, I have heard that it might be coming that new programming in a DVR will be able to 'register' an attached storage device that might then only be able to be used when attached to another device with the same new programming . .

[KenAF]

---

@cjacobs001 wrote:
digital rights management may be the issue.  - If the ports were useable and a customer copied a movie over to an attached storage device, then detached that device and played it elsewhere or made copies of it, who is enabling the piracy ?      Now, I have heard that it might be coming that new programming in a DVR will be able to 'register' an attached storage device that might then only be able to be used when attached to another device with the same new programming . .

---

If / when eSATA is enabled on the QIP7216 DVR, all recordings on the external drive will be tied to the internal drive.  They'll be encrypted; they won't be viewable on a PC or any other device.  It's entirely possible that the recordings will be split across the internal and external drive, resulting in the loss of all recordings when the drive is removed.

[prisaz]

---

@KenAF wrote:

---

@cjacobs001 wrote:
digital rights management may be the issue.  - If the ports were useable and a customer copied a movie over to an attached storage device, then detached that device and played it elsewhere or made copies of it, who is enabling the piracy ?      Now, I have heard that it might be coming that new programming in a DVR will be able to 'register' an attached storage device that might then only be able to be used when attached to another device with the same new programming . .

---

If / when eSATA is enabled on the QIP7216 DVR, all recordings on the external drive will be tied to the internal drive.  They'll be encrypted; they won't be viewable on a PC or any other device.  It's entirely possible that the recordings will be split across the internal and external drive, resulting in the loss of all recordings when the drive is removed.

---

Yea I would second that. It should be capable, but do you think the STB existing CPU could handle all the encryption on the external drive, the IP and everything else at the same time? I think we have plenty of existing issues with the STB without adding more. We either need to wait for a better box or buy a TIVO.

Message Edited by prisaz on 03-21-2009 02:01 PM

[KenAF]

---

@prisaz wrote:

---

@KenAF wrote:

---

@cjacobs001 wrote:
digital rights management may be the issue.  - If the ports were useable and a customer copied a movie over to an attached storage device, then detached that device and played it elsewhere or made copies of it, who is enabling the piracy ?      Now, I have heard that it might be coming that new programming in a DVR will be able to 'register' an attached storage device that might then only be able to be used when attached to another device with the same new programming . .

---

If / when eSATA is enabled on the QIP7216 DVR, all recordings on the external drive will be tied to the internal drive.  They'll be encrypted; they won't be viewable on a PC or any other device.  It's entirely possible that the recordings will be split across the internal and external drive, resulting in the loss of all recordings when the drive is removed.

---

Yea I would second that. It should be capable, but do you think the STB existing CPU could handle all the encryption on the external drive, the IP and everything else at the same time

---

As I noted in another thread, the problem with adding / enabling features is that these Motorola DVRs are based on rather slow processors with limited memory and limited bus and memory bandwidth.  This limits what Verizon can do with their DVR at any given time.  The FiOS DVR can record two different HD programs, while you watch a third, previously recorded show...while it streams a fourth HDTV MPEG-2 recording to a HDTV STB elsewhere in your home.  That consumes most of the available resources on the Motorola platform, which makes it very tricky to support other features.  Motorola may still find a way, but it will take a fair bit of work to deliver eSATA expansion that is reliable.

[mistrhanky]

And I think most people would understand and accept that answer. What I don't think anyone accepts is the absolutely pathetic and unacceptable firmware limit of 160GB of space regardless of the size of the internal drive. There is a point where you ask for another drive for those who really packrat there stuff, then there is just basic use. The FIOS DVR has the most pathetic disk space of any provider out there.

[Keyboards]

---

@mistrhanky wrote:
And I think most people would understand and accept that answer. What I don't think anyone accepts is the absolutely pathetic and unacceptable firmware limit of 160GB of space regardless of the size of the internal drive. There is a point where you ask for another drive for those who really packrat there stuff, then there is just basic use. The FIOS DVR has the most pathetic disk space of any provider out there.

---

Motorola is working on and Verizon is testing an STB with a larger drive - no ETA for availability.  Any provider that uses a Motorola STB has the same limitations, not just Verizon.  Some providers get "more" storage because they further compress the source signal which Verizon doesn't - Comcast is now squeezing 3 HD channels per QAM whereas Verizon still only puts 2 per.  Higher compression equals lower bit rates and less storage requirements at the expense of image quality.  Pick your poison carefully 

[KenAF]

---

@mistrhanky wrote:
And I think most people would understand and accept that answer. What I don't think anyone accepts is the absolutely pathetic and unacceptable firmware limit of 160GB of space regardless of the size of the internal drive. There is a point where you ask for another drive for those who really packrat there stuff, then there is just basic use. The FIOS DVR has the most pathetic disk space of any provider out there.

---

To be fair, Brighthouse, Comcast, Cablevision, Cox, and Time Warner all use DVRs with the same 160GB capacity as the FiOS DVR.  Verizon offer better picture quality than these providers, and better picture quality (=more bandwidth) translates into more space used by each recording.  Of course, some Brighthouse, Cablevision, and Time Warner service areas also use DVRs from Scientific Atlanta, which support eSATA expansion.

I think it's safe to assume that the next-generation FiOS DVR will feature a significantly larger hard drive.  A next-generation FiOS DVR will almost certainly feature a newer, faster processor as well, so Verizon won't be crippled by the limitations of the existing Motorola hardware when it looks to add commonly requested features.

Message Edited by KenAF on 03-21-2009 08:38 PM

[mistrhanky]

That's the thing though right, those others offer services that allow the customer to expand at there own cost. However, ALL of them are pathetic in the space they support. For God sakes, I have a 5 year old base model direct tv that had double the space. There really is no excuse for even offering a product with such a small limit. I understand they are dealing with some motorola limitation, however as the customer, I just don't care. They need to do more. Verizon throws a lot of money into buying into every ridiculous content model, but no money into upgrading the basic hardware. If they did, it would be hard to ever choose anything else.

I say that as 1) a verizon employee and 2) someone who became disgusted with Directv and dumped them after 10 years. I cannot say at this point that I would not go back though. Having to rent two dvr's(at very costly monthly fees) just to be able to record my standard slate of shows, is not something that encourages me to stick around. Directv at least offered expansion and a lot more space standard.